Datasets:

---

innovation-hacking2

/

shitposting_dataset3

like 0

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\"." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship..." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied.", ">\n\nEh, I rather just see if I vibe with someone, having a pleasant date seems more valuable to me than start treating it like an interrogation. I mean if you don't enjoy the first date enough to want a second it seems more like a waste of time to discuss all the important stuff right away" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied.", ">\n\nEh, I rather just see if I vibe with someone, having a pleasant date seems more valuable to me than start treating it like an interrogation. I mean if you don't enjoy the first date enough to want a second it seems more like a waste of time to discuss all the important stuff right away", ">\n\nWhat's the point of vibing someone if it might be someone you have seriously non negotiables with. Your logic is flawed." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied.", ">\n\nEh, I rather just see if I vibe with someone, having a pleasant date seems more valuable to me than start treating it like an interrogation. I mean if you don't enjoy the first date enough to want a second it seems more like a waste of time to discuss all the important stuff right away", ">\n\nWhat's the point of vibing someone if it might be someone you have seriously non negotiables with. Your logic is flawed.", ">\n\nTo have fun, see what kinds of people you like being around meet someone that might work better as a friend, the fact that not everyone is looking for a serious relationship . . ." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied.", ">\n\nEh, I rather just see if I vibe with someone, having a pleasant date seems more valuable to me than start treating it like an interrogation. I mean if you don't enjoy the first date enough to want a second it seems more like a waste of time to discuss all the important stuff right away", ">\n\nWhat's the point of vibing someone if it might be someone you have seriously non negotiables with. Your logic is flawed.", ">\n\nTo have fun, see what kinds of people you like being around meet someone that might work better as a friend, the fact that not everyone is looking for a serious relationship . . .", ">\n\nI thought it was pretty obvious this was about people looking for serious relationship. Obviously there are non negotiables that don't matter to a casual relationship." ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied.", ">\n\nEh, I rather just see if I vibe with someone, having a pleasant date seems more valuable to me than start treating it like an interrogation. I mean if you don't enjoy the first date enough to want a second it seems more like a waste of time to discuss all the important stuff right away", ">\n\nWhat's the point of vibing someone if it might be someone you have seriously non negotiables with. Your logic is flawed.", ">\n\nTo have fun, see what kinds of people you like being around meet someone that might work better as a friend, the fact that not everyone is looking for a serious relationship . . .", ">\n\nI thought it was pretty obvious this was about people looking for serious relationship. Obviously there are non negotiables that don't matter to a casual relationship.", ">\n\nNot really. It talks about dating" ]

[ "I don't think this should be unpopular, but I don't think it's completely necessary to cram ALL of them into the first date. Ask them about a few of the non-negotiables between casual conversation, covering them all in the span of a couple dates. Unless you want to spend the whole date vetting them and not having any time to enjoy it that is.", ">\n\nThe only aim on a first date is to ascertain (i) if there is chemistry, and (ii) if so, if that chemistry is or could be romantic. Everything else can come later.", ">\n\nAnd must come later. Shitty people will tell you what you want to hear. Otherwise simply asking 'are you a narcissistic user of people' would save a lot of headaches. Unless you require documentation as well", ">\n\nNo farting or I'm dumping you Barbara", ">\n\nWe're coming to get you, Barbara!", ">\n\nYou've got red on you", ">\n\nI mean, if you want it to feel more like an interview than a first date, sure that's an approach. Might turn off a lot of potential partners that way.\nI certainly believe the big stuff and the deal breakers should be discussed early (and I don't think that's unpopular) but cramming it all into the first date is kind of unnecessary.", ">\n\nDo you want kids? Are you religious? Same bank account or separate? Caregiver of our elderly parents? \nWhy are leaving? I still haven't asked what your family health history is!!", ">\n\nI think the first two are okay, but after that yeah it gets weird.", ">\n\nYeah I feel like briefly talking about religion if it comes up naturally is awesome. \nIt has really endeared me to some partners because we started having a pretty deep conversation really early on, especially after a little wine or whatever. It's really nice to actually learn about the person you're going on a date with, especially if you're like me and get kinda bored with small (or small-er) talk sometimes if you're dating around.\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up.", ">\n\n\nAnd it's REALLY easy to smell red flags once religion comes up\n\nWhat do red flags smell like?", ">\n\nRather like tomatoes one might imagine", ">\n\nThat's what dating sites like OKCupid are for. You put your non-negotiables in, and then don't hit on or accept dates from people who don't meet those.", ">\n\nFor anyone wondering why conservatives are having to fake being liberals to get dates via apps.", ">\n\nI want to know what stage of life they're at and their core values. If they don't align then I'm not going to spend my time explaining my non-negotiables and potentially offend them or make myself feel vulnerable and obligated to justify my views.\nI struggle with communication at times, so can understand why being this direct has appeal though.", ">\n\nI think core values and stage of life fall under non-negotiables.", ">\n\nGood point, and agreed 100%, imo those parts are often percieved in general conversation without adding the pressure of considering someone as a potential partner though, so haven't felt the need to ask directly yet.\nIf things have gone well, I'm content to give them a couple dates to be comfortable enough to have those deep conversations. I value being direct from the start, but I'd also rather a genuine answer than a defensive/awkward one. Waiting for one date or a couple doesn't seem that long in the big scheme of things tbh. I defo get it done early though, it's not my responsibility if someone doesn't know how to communicate their needs and I've given them every opportunity to.", ">\n\nI would probably say second date, but I agree that it should be discussed very early on. I think this is easier as we age and don’t want to waste time.", ">\n\nThe second date sounds about right to me. The first date is for deciding if I like them. If listening to them talk makes me want to fall asleep, or if they treat the server like crap, then I don't need to know whether they want kids or not.", ">\n\nThis is my exact philosophy on dating. Tons of people want kids or pets or whatever other thing. I don’t necessarily vibe with all those people just because we share the same vague life goals.", ">\n\nOr, even better, when online dating out the details of your non negotiables in your profile. That way you don’t need to waste time and money on dates that could never lead to a relationship.", ">\n\nI wish more people did this. It really would save a lot of time", ">\n\nIt baffles me that people can be a year into dating when the topic of marriage and children comes up… and they are trying to compromise then and both end up feeling resentment instead of just getting with someone who has the same priorities in the first place", ">\n\nI think you are overestimating how quickly people fall in love. There is more than enough time after the first date to discuss these things.", ">\n\nWhy waste time with someone who wants things completely different than you do?", ">\n\nWhat is this about wasting time? Are you people in a race or something? You’ll find out if you’re compatible or not by the 4th or 5th date. Relax.", ">\n\nSo you’re into wasting time in a relationship that will go nowhere. Got it.", ">\n\nI’m just saying, what’s the rush? It sounds like you think you need to churn out dates at a very fast rate for some reason. \nA relationship isn’t something you ‘do’. It’s something you experience and enjoy. You’re not gonna find a partner by trolley dash-ing from one first date to the other until you find someone who meets all your ‘non-negotiable’ criteria.", ">\n\nThere’s no point in entertaining a relationship or the idea of one who you have wildly different views on things that cannot be changed. If I know I never want kids but that person does there’s no reason for us to continue seeing each other outside of being friends and no reason to entertain the idea that they can one day change my mind. If you want to get deep into a relationship before realizing you and the other person have extremely different views and wants that’s fine but it’s stupid when it could’ve been avoided by being upfront initially.", ">\n\nNobody is saying you have to get deep into the relationship, though.", ">\n\nEven before. The amount of time I saved by telling straight up I don't want kids, and my mind couldn't be changed is just enormous.", ">\n\nFunny enough, my wife was adamant she didn’t want kids. I did but it wasn’t a deal breaker and I didn’t have a strong opinion on it anyway. Five years into our marriage and she came to me wanting to have a kid. Just keep in mind often, but obviously not always, opinions and feelings can change.", ">\n\nThe childfree people will hate this comment lol", ">\n\nRabidly child-free people hate most things ime lol", ">\n\nThe first date might be a bit extreme, but I can agree that those things should come out very early. \nI knew a guy, he generally had terrible advice, but he did say something that stuck with me. He said figure out the top seven things you want in a mate, and out of that seven, figure out three that are non negotiable. You should know where a person stands on those three within the first few weeks of dating. For most people, this is probably two or three dates at most.", ">\n\nLet's first figure out if we even like spending time together and if there's any attraction before we start getting clinical about things.\nBesides, \"non-negotiables\" in my experience are usually more hypothetical than anything. Yes, certain things (no abusiveness, etc) should go without saying but things like \"Must be into country music, must vote this certain way\" etc are actually easily negotiable if you meet someone you really like.", ">\n\nWhen I read that it's more like, \"I want to have kids someday\" / \"I never want to have to have kids.\" May was well get that out of the way quick. Dating Apps have their flaws, but at least it lets people be up front about these things. I can immediately swipe left on anyone who says both \"looking for long term relationship\" and \"doesn't want kids\".", ">\n\nThat and marriage, career goals, religion, being open to move", ">\n\nI can’t imagine why anyone who’s serious looking for a life partner would think anything else", ">\n\nGuess I figure the fist date is just to see if you can even carry a conversation. A few dates later to just see if we are compatible in bed. Unless you are in a hurry, dating can just be fun and casual. Not every date is step towards a long term relationship. I figure when these topics come up naturally is when someone you are dating is growing to become a potential long term relationship.", ">\n\ni feel as if it could come up naturally on the first date. whether or not each party is serious and is looking to settle down. i couldn't imagine spending a couple hours with a potential SO and not asking what they're looking for out of this whole thing.", ">\n\nNo, that just makes it seem too forced and like I’m engaging into a contractual obligation with the other person at that point. It’s normal to experience shit you don’t like in someone else when getting to know them, and using communication when you get to that point to either agree or disagree is more important than just listing off the shit you like or don’t like at the very first instance of interacting with someone.", ">\n\nI mean... that's what OkCupid did. Been awhile since I've been in the dating scene, is it no longer popular?", ">\n\nThat's assuming that you're only dating with the goal of settling down into a long term relationship...", ">\n\nThere's many deal breakers you don't think of until you come across them, it's impossible to know sometimes even until years later", ">\n\nJust make your prospective partner fill out a brief 74 question online survey, background check, urinalysis, and provide 3 references of ex partners. and if they pass they can move on to the in person interview. \nOr you can just have a cup of coffee with someone and see if you like them or not.", ">\n\nBold of you to assume I have 3 references to give.", ">\n\nYou can use me. \"Saw a Reddit comment of his once, he seemed like a nice guy. Based on his username I think he likes pet pictures and memes.\"", ">\n\nRecently tried dating on Reddit. What a focused group of men. Some were simply so mature it was amazing. Others, not so much. Better than ANY app I’ve used to date. It’s so to the point, by the first date I was very confident on both parties intentions.", ">\n\nWait what? Lol Reddit dating?!\nNo judging but based your history, I think your idea of “focused” and “intentions” is a bit different than most lmao", ">\n\nUnfortunately… yes r/r4r or r/foreveralonedating", ">\n\nAh…yes, I’ve seen those. If I’m single again, I’ll stick to hinge/bumble, thanks lol", ">\n\nAh yes, virgin dating advice", ">\n\nAverage reddit dating advice", ">\n\nI discuss nonnegotiables BEFORE the date. No point in going out if you know right away you don’t align lol", ">\n\nAgree with this too", ">\n\nI considered posting this too hahaha. \nI'm baffled at how many Redditors go \"my bf/husband want kids, I don't. We have a 2 yr relationship.\"\nAre people really not clever enough in relationships to talk these things out... before entering them? It seems like such a no-brainer to me.", ">\n\nNot saying this is the root cause of that, but its become a bit of a trend for conservative men to lie about their core values on dating apps/sites in order to land dates, with the idea that once someone is emotionally invested enough they can slow trickle their values and circumvent the non-negotiables.", ">\n\nEugh, that's awful. In that case I'd feel hella betrayed, definitely enough to end the relationship. I'm sorry for people having to go through that, no one deserves to be manipulated like that 😔", ">\n\nI didn't do this on the first date, but I did on the third. And it's possible to discuss without it being interviewish or awkward. No guy was ever scared off for this, and now I'm happily married over 10 years now, while not wasting my time with fundamentally incompatible people.", ">\n\nPreach\nI'll go even farther and say they should be on your dating PROFILE (when you meet through Internet)", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of checking non negotiables if there is no spark. Just let it be fun on very first date", ">\n\nWhat’s the point of a spark if there are disagreements on non negotiables?", ">\n\nAgree, it gets into dangerous territory when you already like someone and they're bad for you.", ">\n\nExactly. That’s my approach as well. When I’ve dated in the past I’ve always asked whether the person wants marriage and kids. If they can’t handle that level of bluntness then they won’t get on with me very well. I’m blunt in all areas of life, a first date is no exception. I just want to make sure that we are on the same page so no one catches feels if we’re not compatible and no one wastes time.", ">\n\nthat's not crazy and a lot of people do that. That's surface level conversation OP is talking about much deeper", ">\n\nDisagree. Non negotiables should and could be discussed prior to the first date. What’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible? Naturally working in non negotiables during conversations PRIOR to the first date has saved me from multiple pointless first dates.", ">\n\n\nWhat’s the point of waiting until the first date only to figure out you aren’t compatible?\n\nBecause that's what the first date is for.... Getting to know someone, seeing if you'll be compatible and like each other. You use what you learn in the first date to decide if there will be a second date.", ">\n\nI second this", ">\n\nIt definitely would! Big red flag. Would indicate to me that this relationship would be transactional and I need to get the hell out there.", ">\n\nTransactional means “I only do something for you if you do something for me”. OP is saying you should say if you ever do or don’t want kids or if you don’t believe in vaccination or you would never accept a gay child. Hypotheticals that would end the relationship that you need to make clear before getting invested as you could be completely incompatible if not.", ">\n\nI totally do respect your experience and this was really eloquently said. As a child of parents who “stuck it out” I would say (though this is a case by case basis thing) most child psychologists will tell you staying in a marriage where your children watch you be unfulfilled or unhappy is not best. My parents did that and not only did I not have a healthy relationship to model my understanding of romantic love, but I grew up in a house where nobody was happy and there was a lot of resentment. Kids notice that kind of stuff.\nI agree that a lot of things change but there are certain things I definitely wouldn’t stick around hoping change. The AITA is full of stories of married couples who had differences on vaccination, kids (number of if any at all), living with parents, living in the city, moving far from family, divorce at all! First date is definitely not the time for all the heavy stuff but there is for sure some things I find crucial to get out of the way. I’m also very into politics and a dealbreaker for me is someone who considers themself “not political” or is against voting in general with an “it doesn’t count” attitude. Chemistry is great but values that differ aren’t things I’m ready to wait around and hope develop or mature, as if they don’t it’ll be an investment of time I don’t get back over something I could’ve flagged ages ago.", ">\n\nThat definitely happens. But in my opinion, not reconciling with each other and just ‘existing’ together is well known to cause issues with the children later on. So my opinion that won’t fall under the category of ‘doing them right’.\nSo I’m my experience, as my wife and I have done repeatedly, we’ve had some real hard negotiating sessions where one of us had to take a massive hit to our egos, take the L for the greater good, and trust that there would be some time in the future where the other would take the L for the sake of the family. And that certainly has happened. There’s trauma that is sometimes born with that, but there’s trust that it’s all worth it as we witness the joys of parenting and their development. At least that’s my hope.\nWho knows, they may still end up pieces of shit. But at the very least we could sleep well knowing we did our best.", ">\n\nI spoke about the non negotiables when we talked about being exclusive. I don’t think it’s necessary in the dating period, but as soon as it gets serious, it was important to me to know that we’re on the same page.", ">\n\nyes bro, absolutely valid take. setting boundaries are important, especially if they’re non-negotiable", ">\n\nThis is what I love about online dating, most apps encourage people to just list their politics, family plans, job, religions and whether they drink / smoke etc on their profile so most main bases covered.", ">\n\nI disagree. The first date should be about fun/ chemistry. Plus the ‘first date’ is not always so clearly defined. Sometimes you look up and realize you’ve been on several dates and things are getting serious.", ">\n\nI think its a bit much on the first date. But should happen within the first 3-4 dates at least.\nTo me , too many people use first dates to disqualify and go in with that “ looking for a reason to say no” instead of “ looking for a reason to say yes”\nFirst dates should be light hearted, fun, give the person an honest chance and see if theres an initial connection. Dates 3/4 before you get too serious have the talk. Non negotiable, sex talk. Etc", ">\n\nI think a lot of non negotiable can be talked about before a date, but that's why I'm a fan of dating websites.\nI think there are also a lot of situations where people don't realize things are non negotiable until they've dealt with them for a while in a new relationship.", ">\n\nYou know it’s funny. I definitely would. Never do this on a first date. As I find the point of a first date is basically just to get the persons vibe and if you can manage that then that’s pretty good. But with online dating most of this is available in someone’s profile and I personally found that super helpful.", ">\n\nNo offense….but I disagree. \nSpeak about non negotiable stuff before the first date and save even more time and energy.", ">\n\nMaybe not all on the first date, but definitely before entering a serious relationship.", ">\n\nObviously this is your preference, but I could not imagine a more transactional approach to what should be a non-transactional, organic process. Yours is a short straight line from first date to life partner (or whatever end you seek). That's just not how life works. While that may be the eventual progression of a relationship, it is not how they start. And you don't get to demand the CEO benefits you want to earn in 20 years during your first interview for the entry level job.\nRelationships are organic. You are cheating then the opportunity to grow, for a real exchange and joining of interests. \nI could think of nothing more off-putting than sitting down at the restaurant to... \"What would you like to drink...? Oh, and do you want kids? because if not, we ought to just call it a night.\" It seems to me either you need to decide you even like spending time with each other on the first couple/few dates or more likely that you didn't spend enough time with each other as friends before asking them out if thisbis what you feel the need to do.\nI'm so glad I don't have to deal with any more 1st dates, and certainly glad I never had one as you describe. Good luck!", ">\n\nI tried it and turns out they were uncomfortable. Never thought it would be received badly because to me it’s a no brainer thing. If you can’t handle answering some questions then you may not be ready for a relationship! I would say if you aren’t looking for a serious relationship you probably should avoid doing this. In the future, I will ease into it a bit more. Just my experience ✌🏼", ">\n\nYou are right. If you are looking for a serious relationship. If you are just out dating to have fun then it doesn't really matter.", ">\n\nBIG agree.", ">\n\nThere is a time and place for discussing the non-negotiables. The first date should really be focused on having chemistry. If there’s no chemistry in the now, why waste the breath on the future? The non-negotiables should absolutely be discussed in the first few dates though and would recommend tackling one at a time instead of powering through like taking a bunch of laxative before starting an escape room. \nI have been bombarded with questions on the first date and sure it gets the awkward questions out of the way but shouldn’t the non-negotiables be a point to say this is important to you and why? \nEx.\nQ: I have a kid, is that going to be a problem?\nSure a kid may or may not be an issue superficially but what about discussing it. I want a future father/mother figure for the kiddo, what is the relation with the former parent if there is one, etc. These important concepts may not get teased out and could become non-negotiables for the the partner that they didn’t have a chance to determine on the spot.\nMore importantly talk and be honest. The skeletons in the closet will always rattle at some point or another.", ">\n\nWhere’s the fun in that? Where the social dance we all do to get to know each other? We ain’t robots. We need to take our time as well. There’s a time for those non negotiables to be discussed but with time. I fell like you just went through something and felt the need to write this up.", ">\n\nSure if you want to date a robot lol.", ">\n\nThis is where dating apps come in handy. They make you answer the tough and awkward but important questions", ">\n\nThis is r/UnpopularOpinion not r/CommonSense", ">\n\nmaybe like the 3rd date. thats a lot of heavy shit to discuss with basically a stranger. at least see if you like them first, then talk about non negotiables and expectations", ">\n\nAnd then you really like them and don't agree on the non negotiables. Sucks.", ">\n\nAt least I’m having fun, and not going through a series of interviews only to find later despite the fact we both want kids we really have nothing in common. Besides, it’s like three dates, not a relationship. It’s not that heartbreaking.", ">\n\nAh right, having fun is what counts in a relationship.", ">\n\nIt’s not the only thing, but I don’t want to waste time talking to someone about having kids or getting married when I don’t even know if I actually enjoy spending time with them. If I’m not enjoying myself, then there won’t be a second date. If I am, maybe we can talk about if there’s a viable future.", ">\n\nThen don't waste time talking on those things. It's better to waste a few years having a very fun relationship with many compromises.", ">\n\nThere’s a middle ground here. Don’t turn first dates into a boring/awkward interview. But also don’t go through unnecessary heartbreak after you find out two years in that you guys have no future. Have fun on the first couple of dates, and before things get serious/commuted discuss whether there is long term viability.", ">\n\nHow about before the first date. Don’t waste time", ">\n\nRight!!! I’ve always said this! And people critize me for like but you know what, I’ll rather be alone than badly accompanied.", ">\n\nEh, I rather just see if I vibe with someone, having a pleasant date seems more valuable to me than start treating it like an interrogation. I mean if you don't enjoy the first date enough to want a second it seems more like a waste of time to discuss all the important stuff right away", ">\n\nWhat's the point of vibing someone if it might be someone you have seriously non negotiables with. Your logic is flawed.", ">\n\nTo have fun, see what kinds of people you like being around meet someone that might work better as a friend, the fact that not everyone is looking for a serious relationship . . .", ">\n\nI thought it was pretty obvious this was about people looking for serious relationship. Obviously there are non negotiables that don't matter to a casual relationship.", ">\n\nNot really. It talks about dating", ">\n\nGender identity. Im trans and have full support to the community but getting in a whole relationship with somebody before finding out their trans can litterally ruin the whole relationship. Especially if they havent had surgery. Somebody might just not want to date somebody with the same genitals as them, and thats fine, thats not transphobic." ]