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I remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now? | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine."
] |
>
Since China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?"
] |
>
Thanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road."
] |
>
The timing seems a little off | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad."
] |
>
What timing would you prefer? | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off"
] |
>
One where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?"
] |
>
From one extreme to another.. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing"
] |
>
The scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted.
I'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.
What happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it? | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another.."
] |
>
Besides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?"
] |
>
!Remindme 3 months. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West."
] |
>
China putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems! | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months."
] |
>
China: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”
Great! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!"
] |
>
… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition."
] |
>
Same people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way."
] |
>
Nope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao"
] |
>
Redditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown
Redditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”."
] |
>
There’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world"
] |
>
Why did over 150 million Americans get sick then? | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently."
] |
>
Whataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.
The millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?"
] |
>
You said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well."
] |
>
I said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck."
] |
>
Why is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine."
] |
>
Not good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases! | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck."
] |
>
Thank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!"
] |
>
Thanks China for all the variants. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh"
] |
>
As Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants."
] |
>
Please, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach"
] |
>
Do let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.
I like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks"
] |
>
We should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge."
] |
>
Quarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in"
] |
>
Ugh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism."
] |
>
That’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't."
] |
>
How else did it enter the country then? | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden."
] |
>
It should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time? | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?"
] |
>
I still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?"
] |
>
Got what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing."
] |
>
Why doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support."
] |
>
Must be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China."
] |
>
Sinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's "brutal" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died."
] |
>
The lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.
China hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China"
] |
>
Just in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them! | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief."
] |
>
Begs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?
And now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.
On top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.
Fuck you. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!"
] |
>
What a garbage comment | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you."
] |
>
Great news, good to see. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment"
] |
>
F1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!! | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see."
] |
>
I'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!"
] |
>
Time for wave 3 fuckers!
China needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time."
] |
>
Ready to export | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time.",
">\n\nTime for wave 3 fuckers! \nChina needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports."
] |
>
And the biggest human migration is coming during Chinese New Year (January 22). | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time.",
">\n\nTime for wave 3 fuckers! \nChina needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports.",
">\n\nReady to export"
] |
>
Rather amusing to watch the Chinese government make threats against countries that want to have a negative Covid test upon entry while they still will require it to return home | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time.",
">\n\nTime for wave 3 fuckers! \nChina needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports.",
">\n\nReady to export",
">\n\nAnd the biggest human migration is coming during Chinese New Year (January 22)."
] |
>
So they do this right when they get a ton of people sick? They are pure evil. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time.",
">\n\nTime for wave 3 fuckers! \nChina needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports.",
">\n\nReady to export",
">\n\nAnd the biggest human migration is coming during Chinese New Year (January 22).",
">\n\nRather amusing to watch the Chinese government make threats against countries that want to have a negative Covid test upon entry while they still will require it to return home"
] |
>
China wants to hose the world one more time. | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time.",
">\n\nTime for wave 3 fuckers! \nChina needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports.",
">\n\nReady to export",
">\n\nAnd the biggest human migration is coming during Chinese New Year (January 22).",
">\n\nRather amusing to watch the Chinese government make threats against countries that want to have a negative Covid test upon entry while they still will require it to return home",
">\n\nSo they do this right when they get a ton of people sick? They are pure evil."
] |
> | [
"I was teaching English in Beijing in January of 2020 when this all got started and I sort of got stuck there. I just left the country for the first time since 2020 last week due to a combination of a death in the family back home and my contract in China expiring this month giving me a convenient push to get out, back in the US for now. The most amazing thing about China's reversals of their COVID restrictions is how sudden they were. I remember staying up all night in early December because there were rumors going around on WeChat that a full nationwide lockdown with martial law was coming, then 6 hours later they announced that testing would no longer be mandatory, restaurants could re-open, and and we didn't need to show a health code to take public transportation.\nGradually things opened up more and more but the suddenness of the shift from some of the harshest lockdowns since early 2020 to just everything opening up normally was shocking and the explosion in cases that followed really goes to show that there simply was no plan for an orderly reversal of zero COVID restrictions. I think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately just because there was no real option of taking the time to properly plan things out because the virus was already more or less out of control and the people, including the people in the big tier 1 cities like Beijing, Shanghai, and Guangzhou, were just too fed up with it all.\nAt one point a couple months ago I asked several of my Chinese friends whether they were more afraid of catching COVID or being placed in a lockdown and every single one of them said lockdown. That's when I knew that a change was inevitable, but I really never expected it to come so suddenly.",
">\n\n\nI think at least one faction within the Party must have been really shaken up by the protests and put pressure on Xi to lift everything immediately\n\nBingo, we just witnessed mass protesting actually working, and in China out of all places. Xi lost a ton of face when large groups started protesting in China's biggest tier-1 cities, and the risk of escalation definitely scared him.",
">\n\nNow do Iran",
">\n\nThey literally are",
">\n\nChina opens its borders for the first time on Sunday after nearly three years of isolation and takes a step closer to ending its 'Covid Zero' policy designed to curb the spread of the coronavirus pandemic.\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\nAt this time, a wave of Chinese residents are expected to return to the country on their way home. Thus, the first preparations for the reopening of the Asian country's borders have been made.\nAs reported by the Chinese newspaper 'Global Times', the authorities have intensified their efforts at the borders of the city of Shenzhen in anticipation of the reopening with the neighboring region of Hong Kong, including conducting drills, examining equipment and decorating the posts that will welcome the expected influx of passengers.",
">\n\n\nStarting this Sunday, China will no longer require a quarantine period for people arriving in the country but will continue to require a negative Covid-19 test within the last 48 hours.\n\nHighlighted for visibility: the 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do. \nIn fact, this level of restriction is a new step down, starting today.",
">\n\n\nthe 'discriminatory' practices which China has pledged to retaliate against 'based upon the principle of reciprocity' is something they already do.\n\nNot really. The quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality. It was also combined with domestic restrictions against every little COVID flare-up. That made sense scientifically speaking. What we in the West are doing now has no scientific basis. Our own scientists were advising against it, but they were ignored.\nWhat we are doing is politically motivated. We want to force China to be more transparent about hospitalizations and deaths - something the CCP is lying about to keep face. We want Chinese citizens to know that the 3 years of restrictions did not protect them as much as the CCP claims. Eventually they still sustained millions of COVID-related deaths.\nThat's why China is so enraged about these restrictions. They want to keep lying to their own people to save face.",
">\n\n\nThe quarantine China was imposing was universal, for all arrivals, not discriminating by country of origin or nationality.\n\nJust for clarity: China has basically been completely closed to foreign nationals for almost 3 years, and continues to be as of the 8th. This so-called \"reopening\" is about allowing Chinese citizens to leave China and come back. It is not about allowing foreigners to come to China, so it's not really a \"reopening\" of any sort.\nYou cannot obtain a Chinese visa for tourism. You might be able to get a visa for business/work, study and to visit family, but you have to apply and there is no guarantee your visa will be approved.",
">\n\nChina just want to export virus not to import virus. This motive is abundantly clear.",
">\n\nAren’t they having a huge spike in Covid??",
">\n\n🚩🚩",
">\n\nJust in time for variant XBB.1.5, the most contagious variant yet.",
">\n\nAny new variant that becomes widespread will be \"the most contagious yet\". If they weren't, they'd spread less than what already exists and they'd die out quickly (quickly enough that we probably would never realize it existed anyway).",
">\n\nYes, and perhaps that’s why China is opening up despite the new variant. Since new and more contagious variants keep appearing, they may not have any other choice. COVID is here to stay.",
">\n\nBut China does not have the neccessary vaccine and technology to cope with the rapid evolution of the virus and Xi refuses to adopt the western vaccines without stealing the technology first. Endemic in China will be a painful journey.",
">\n\nNo doubt that’s true.",
">\n\nSo here comes another massive wave of COVID. Who knows how many variants in a China are about to be set free.",
">\n\nWell, they asked for it by protesting lockdowns, so the CCP just said OK, fuck you guys and your protests, let's open EVERYTHING and you can all die!",
">\n\nThat's exactly the bullshit line the CCP is pushing. They lost control of the spread before the lifting of restrictions, they just used the protests as an excuse because zero covid had failed spectacularly. \n7th of December the restrictions are lifted, 10th of December the first day with explosive new cases. Shortly after they stop reporting numbers. \nYou don't get dozens of millions infected and showing symptoms in 3 days.",
">\n\nAnd Zero COVID was always going to fail. If eliminating a respiratory virus by quarantines and lockdowns was even theoretically possible, China is probably the one place that could do it, thanks to their over the top level of authoritarian control. But it's just not scientifically feasible. The virus can linger for too long and spread too easily.\nThe window to eliminate COVID was when it was a fringe virus contained to one part of the world. That window closed decisively 3 years ago.",
">\n\nYou say \"always going to fail\" like they haven't gone 3 years without the death and destruction seen across the world.\nThis is the exact same dumbass argument people were making for \"let it rip\" and \"do like Sweden\" which ended up being dumb as fuck.",
">\n\nHow was swedens approach the dumb one? Please explain without mentioning norway and/or finland.",
">\n\nI'm not allowed to mention how they allowed more of their citizens to die than their neighbours? Strange rules.",
">\n\nWatch as other places in the world receive a spike in covid cases in the coming weeks",
">\n\nIt was already spiking even before they opened up",
">\n\nWasn't everyone pissed they were doing lockdowns?",
">\n\nThey’re pissed how, once again, China isn’t cooperating with WHO and informing them of what’s going on. Plus the whole hypocrisy where they can bar travelers from entering but get mad when other countries have the audacity to do the same thing to Chinese travelers.",
">\n\nChina was quaranting all arrivals. What they're criticizing others for are selective travel restrictions that target China specifically while ignoring other countries that also have COVID spikes due to newly arising variants. Western epidemiologists also criticize these restrictions because they are ineffective, unnecessary and purely politically motivated. \nThe political motivation is to force China to be a bit more transparent when it comes to their hospitalization and death statistics. While China has been publishing sequencing data, they're clearly dishonest about the scale of the suffering in the country. The West wants to prevent Chinese citizens being lied to about how well the CCP has handled the pandemic.",
">\n\nI mean i wouldn't be so quick to assume altruism on the part of countries in Europe in America, many of whom lied and continue to lie about their own situations",
">\n\nAnyone travelling into China within next few months must be a huge risk taker considering how Chinese health care system is collapsing due to covid patients.",
">\n\nYes, but then it reminds me of the initial waves that affected Italy and NYC early on, in the sense that in the coming weeks it will level down. Yearly vaccination seems to be the only way out now :/",
">\n\nAnother thing to note is that Lunar New Year is approaching, which probably added additional pressure to lifting restrictions.",
">\n\nRelease the kraken!",
">\n\nAs a Shanghai expat I'm all for this re-opening the borders so I can do my long-awaited international trips that had been denied for 3 years with these insane lockdowns. Millions of local Chinese are thinking the exact same thing and are going to do these trips. There is basically nothing that can be done to stop it.",
">\n\nA lot of counties are shutting their borders to Chinese citizens though. Probably going to wreck havoc on south East Asian and African countries though.",
">\n\nEh? Preflight covid testing is not shutting down borders. Which countries are barring entry completely?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 91%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nChina's surge in cases has caused concern internationally and more than a dozen countries are now demanding COVID tests from travellers from China.\nSources told Reuters that China is in talks with Pfizer Inc to secure a licence that will allow domestic drugmakers to manufacture and distribute a generic version of the U.S. firm's COVID antiviral drug Paxlovid in China.\nChina reported three new COVID deaths in the mainland for Friday, bringing its official virus death toll since the pandemic began to 5,267, one of the lowest in the world.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: China^#1 COVID^#2 INFECTION^#3 more^#4 travel^#5",
">\n\nNo it's okay you guys can stay shut down. It's really dangerous out here in the rest of the world you don't want to test it.",
">\n\nIf they handled it a little better the protests may have not been so severe. You lock people in apartment building and you should expect people to revolt",
">\n\nPutting on my wishful-thinking-cap: Did Chinese people just learn that protesting works?",
">\n\nProtesting is not a new thing in China. Google search has millions of articles of protesting in China.\nOr we can play stupid; China so dumb, USA number one freedom!",
">\n\nI mean, you're reducing this to anecdotal google searches but I know that any protest against China's Covid policies was quickly shut down by police and disappeared on Chinese social media. If you're citing google, I can cite google.\nOnly a few weeks ago, protesting the Chinese government about zero-Covid was described as mostly futile by pretty much anyone who described the Chinese situation and yet, here we are.",
">\n\nFirst reddit was complaining about the zero covid strategy, now its complaining about abandoning the zero covid strategy, try to have some consistency will you",
">\n\nThere are millions of people here and many of them have different views.",
">\n\nBad news for the rest of the world",
">\n\nI just spent the last 8 months traveling the world. I'm just glad I had this opportunity to travel without having to face the hoards of bus tourists from China.\nTime to head back home...",
">\n\nFolks from China deserve to enjoy visiting other countries either in buses or alone, just as you did. Their government hiding a major COVID wave is however quite disappointing.",
">\n\nThey'd deserve it a lot more if they weren't the worst tourists on the globe. Chinese people abroad treat everyone like they're beneath them, as if the chinese are on some sort of fucking safari looking at all the wild animals.",
">\n\nTo a limit, but we shouldn’t generalize as I wouldn’t want a negative label being applied on me.",
">\n\nwas this article brought to us by internet explorer or something? Spain's been fielding planes from China with 50%+ COVID rates for like a month now..",
">\n\nPerhaps they will also swear off their organ harvesting program",
">\n\nLord help all the people in the countries Chinese tourists are flocking to.",
">\n\nThey'll mostly be fine.",
">\n\nI remember our western ‘expert’ commentators saying how Xi couldn’t just back out of the Covid Zero policy because he had tied so much personal prestige to it... It was ‘his’ policy... where are those commentators now?",
">\n\nSince China does not seem to care to alleviate WHO concern, China can expect less understanding Western nations to impose measures to restrict Chinese from traveling to other countries down the road.",
">\n\nThanks for the link. Unfortunately, Western countries are in unison in this regard of testing Chinese travelers because of lack of transparency by government. As usual it is the people who will end up suffering be it at home or abroad.",
">\n\nThe timing seems a little off",
">\n\nWhat timing would you prefer?",
">\n\nOne where they get to be the super hero that plants the American flag over bejing",
">\n\nFrom one extreme to another..",
">\n\nThe scaremongering about reopening in China is unwarranted. \nI'm not an opponent of being safe and implementing travel controls for Chinese citizens at the moment, but it's jumping to conclusions and baseless to assume that China reopening is doom and gloom for the world.\nWhat happened to trusting the science that we'll assimilate covid as just another flu in the long run and that everyone will eventually get it?",
">\n\nBesides, the variants currently circulating in China are old news for us. Our immune systems are already equipped to fight them off. There's not gonna be a second BF.7 or BA.5.2 wave in the West.",
">\n\n!Remindme 3 months.",
">\n\nChina putting another thing in the, •Fuck It Bucket• it seems!",
">\n\nChina: “Phuk it, we can’t contain it! UNLEASH IT UPON EVERYONE!!”\nGreat! Looks like someone playing Pandemic: 2023 edition.",
">\n\n… and deliberately tries to infect the world along the way.",
">\n\nSame people calling for China to abandon Covid zero now complaining about China abandoning Covid zero lmao",
">\n\nNope. Their unelected government went from one extreme (locking down people in their buildings) to the opposite, and deployed their 50cents army to change their messaging on the Internet as soon as their location population revolted and asked for the CCP and Xi to step down, while he was being “coronated”.",
">\n\nRedditors months ago: China needs to live with the virus and lift the lockdown\nRedditors after China lifts the lockdown: China is infecting the world",
">\n\nThere’s a difference between inhumane lockdowns (caged in containers) and now. The 250 M that just fell sick is because their sinovac vaccine sucks against omicron. The current strategy of infecting the world is the CCP’s response to this apparently.",
">\n\nWhy did over 150 million Americans get sick then?",
">\n\nWhataboutism is a propaganda technique, which shouldn’t excuse bad behavior from the Chinese government.\nThe millions of American who are still getting sick are mostly suffering from breakthrough infections at this point. And the number isn’t getting hidden as the CCP is doing. The folks that aren’t getting vaccinated in the US are victim of conspiracy theories from the right (maga) and some Russian trolls as well.",
">\n\nYou said Chinese vaccines suck because 250M Chinese got sick, so I want to know which vaccine doesn't suck.",
">\n\nI said the vaccine sucks against Omicron the prevailing variant. The latest iteration the Pfizer vaccine seems fine.",
">\n\nWhy is there a current surge of cases in America right now, if we are going by your logic? Your logic is if people get sick then the vaccine suck.",
">\n\nNot good, close down please we don't need more COVID cases!",
">\n\nThank goodness, It’s been three years I have been stuck here and I can finally afford to visit my family! I’m celebrating tbh",
">\n\nThanks China for all the variants.",
">\n\nAs Covid deaths surge. Maybe not the smartest approach",
">\n\nPlease, please do not let them in. We have enough covid problems with the pickup trucker rednecks",
">\n\nDo let them in, but at least with a pre-departure test.\nI like the Hong Kong model where folks are asked to use an at-home test 24 hours prior and take a picture of their result with their name on the cartridge.",
">\n\nWe should just have a 48 hour quarantine for all coming in",
">\n\nQuarantine is a huge drain on resources, and most countries have abandoned it at this point, especially as it kills tourism.",
">\n\nUgh, yea. Fuck tourism. We should prioritize being covid free. Disgusting that we aren't.",
">\n\nThat’s not reasonable. In general these international flights are not case reason for COVID surges. I think in the case of China it’s just uncertain as they are in the middle of a terrible infection wave that’s being hidden.",
">\n\nHow else did it enter the country then?",
">\n\nIt should have been blocked at the very start. I wont deny that the CCP is an idiotic government who didn't handle COVID well initially. But we're beyond that now and COVID is everywhere, so blocking tourism wont cut it. Maybe a lesson for next time?",
">\n\nI still haven't gotten it. We just need to categorize those who have gotten it legally differently from those who have. That way we can give more rights to those that do the right thing.",
">\n\nGot what legally? The disease? Yes, do pre-departure testing and prevent covid positive cases from boarding, I support.",
">\n\nWhy doesn’t the US ban flights from China? Everyone should ban flights from China.",
">\n\nMust be pure chaos in China right now. We'll never hear about it ofc, nor about the millions who died.",
">\n\nSinophobes suffering from major cognitive dissonance today. How can you spend months pretending to be scared of China's \"brutal\" lockdown policies, but also believe that undoing them is an imminent threat to all of humanity? So tired of this, maybe western governments should do something about the massive surges going on in our own countries instead of falling asleep at the fucking wheel and blaming China",
">\n\nThe lockdowns were inhumane, with metal gates being soldered and storm troopers patrolling the streets.\nChina hiding COVID case/death counts in the middle of a wave is also beyond disbelief.",
">\n\nJust in time to spread its new variant around the world. What the hell is wrong with them!",
">\n\nBegs the question if perhaps something more nefarious was going on behind those closed borders other than battling Covid, especially seeing as how they did such a smash-up job of managing that, eh?\nAnd now in light of their wackily over-aggressive stance on countries not immediately opening their borders to their travelers? Nobody's supposed to bat an eye or worry because of YOUR assurances? Bwahahahah.\nOn top of that, YOU treated the rest of the world's travelers like total garbage during all of this shit, and then, the fucking premise under which the whole thing operated? You know, your national competence in dealing with the virus? It was all a sham.\nFuck you.",
">\n\nWhat a garbage comment",
">\n\nGreat news, good to see.",
">\n\nF1 fans worldwide: HAVE THE RACE!!!!!",
">\n\nI'm just happy for the Chinese people and expats in China that they're also past this now and can travel freely again, visiting family in other parts of the country or abroad for Chinese Lunar New Year which is basically the equivalent of our Christmas time.",
">\n\nTime for wave 3 fuckers! \nChina needs to be walled in like Jerusalem in WWZ, or using that film to make another adage, Jerusalem is the rest of the world, the zombies are the chinese finally having the 'zero covid' policy removed and flocking to the airports.",
">\n\nReady to export",
">\n\nAnd the biggest human migration is coming during Chinese New Year (January 22).",
">\n\nRather amusing to watch the Chinese government make threats against countries that want to have a negative Covid test upon entry while they still will require it to return home",
">\n\nSo they do this right when they get a ton of people sick? They are pure evil.",
">\n\nChina wants to hose the world one more time."
] |
He wandered into a cop shop. Felt right at home. | [] |
>
Went in looking for help from his own kind. Were this r/upliftingnews, it got reunited with family. This is r/nottheonion. That little piggy got deported. | [
"He wandered into a cop shop. Felt right at home."
] |
>
Finally, their sex lives can recover. | [
"He wandered into a cop shop. Felt right at home.",
">\n\nWent in looking for help from his own kind. Were this r/upliftingnews, it got reunited with family. This is r/nottheonion. That little piggy got deported."
] |
>
And it only took 3 to 5 minutes | [
"He wandered into a cop shop. Felt right at home.",
">\n\nWent in looking for help from his own kind. Were this r/upliftingnews, it got reunited with family. This is r/nottheonion. That little piggy got deported.",
">\n\nFinally, their sex lives can recover."
] |
> | [
"He wandered into a cop shop. Felt right at home.",
">\n\nWent in looking for help from his own kind. Were this r/upliftingnews, it got reunited with family. This is r/nottheonion. That little piggy got deported.",
">\n\nFinally, their sex lives can recover.",
">\n\nAnd it only took 3 to 5 minutes"
] |
This is a rare case of bad title but interesting post.
I think the issue stems from the portrayal of men in media in general when men and women are selected for their look on film thus creating an artificially high societal standard for beauty. | [] |
>
They aren't just chosen. There are illegal steroids and other substances involved, as well as cosmetic surgeries that 99% of the population is never going to have.
Definitely to create an artificially high standard, as you said. That way, they can sell useless crap to us while we peons try so hard to identify with and embody their cultish brands. | [
"This is a rare case of bad title but interesting post. \nI think the issue stems from the portrayal of men in media in general when men and women are selected for their look on film thus creating an artificially high societal standard for beauty."
] |
> | [
"This is a rare case of bad title but interesting post. \nI think the issue stems from the portrayal of men in media in general when men and women are selected for their look on film thus creating an artificially high societal standard for beauty.",
">\n\nThey aren't just chosen. There are illegal steroids and other substances involved, as well as cosmetic surgeries that 99% of the population is never going to have. \nDefinitely to create an artificially high standard, as you said. That way, they can sell useless crap to us while we peons try so hard to identify with and embody their cultish brands."
] |
team iso-de nice. | [] |
> | [
"team iso-de nice."
] |
This is sad and fucked up. | [] |
>
This is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you. | [
"This is sad and fucked up."
] |
>
Shit parenting. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you."
] |
>
This right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting."
] |
>
SpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six."
] |
>
Annnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination."
] |
>
Jerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting."
] |
>
Let me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her? | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE."
] |
>
Presumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the "parents'" fault. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?"
] |
>
This is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault."
] |
>
You know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on.
It’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone."
] |
>
It’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent.
In the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape.
It’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house.
I totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.” | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help."
] |
>
I'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.
It is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”"
] |
>
What makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone."
] |
>
The incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.
All I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place"
] |
>
Want to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with.
We hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous."
] |
>
I'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not."
] |
>
What are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home? | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids."
] |
>
What are you going to do if there’s an intruder?
Call 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?"
] |
>
Why have the gun? | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me."
] |
>
Some people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?"
] |
>
Having a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt."
] |
>
You all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community
*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary."
] |
>
100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault.
I’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.
It’s pretty bullshit, really. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling"
] |
>
I’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really."
] |
>
My husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a "fuck you. You can't stop me." Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.
This is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum."
] |
>
Cursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well."
] |
>
I have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week."
] |
>
I’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point? | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence."
] |
>
Does anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?"
] |
>
In Virginia? | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition"
] |
>
I meant on the body | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition",
">\n\nIn Virginia?"
] |
>
Her abdomen and her hand. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition",
">\n\nIn Virginia?",
">\n\nI meant on the body"
] |
>
I'm sure the NRA position is every teacher, school staffer and student should be required to bring a gun to school. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition",
">\n\nIn Virginia?",
">\n\nI meant on the body",
">\n\nHer abdomen and her hand."
] |
>
Imagine if a teacher shot a 6yo?
Wait, maybe it would get some attention. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition",
">\n\nIn Virginia?",
">\n\nI meant on the body",
">\n\nHer abdomen and her hand.",
">\n\nI'm sure the NRA position is every teacher, school staffer and student should be required to bring a gun to school."
] |
>
They'll suggest arming the kids to protect themselves against armed teachers who are protecting themselves against armed kids. There's no solution for these geniuses which doesn't involve yet more guns, for some reason. | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition",
">\n\nIn Virginia?",
">\n\nI meant on the body",
">\n\nHer abdomen and her hand.",
">\n\nI'm sure the NRA position is every teacher, school staffer and student should be required to bring a gun to school.",
">\n\nImagine if a teacher shot a 6yo?\nWait, maybe it would get some attention."
] |
>
Maybe if we get rid of schools there will be no more school shootings | [
"This is sad and fucked up.",
">\n\nThis is the only instance where I genuinely feel bad for the victim and the perpetrator. How on earth did this kid get a gun? Imagine ruining your life at six years old before you can even comprehend that you have a whole “life” ahead of you.",
">\n\nShit parenting.",
">\n\nThis right here. He didn’t just have the gun at six, but it was loaded, and he shot it. Which means he’s probably shot it before. At six.",
">\n\nSpaceTabs said it best “shit parenting” My daughter had a .22 caliber rifle at the age of 8. Gun safety was and is paramount. She was taught range procedures when we went target shooting. Annnnd she hunts. ALL of our firearms are unloaded secured in a safe that of which only I have the combination.",
">\n\nAnnnnnnd none of that training matters when someone else's shit kid shoots your kid in the face during second period finger painting.",
">\n\nJerddd…I get your point…and WON’T disagree with you at all…trust me. I was commenting on what I do as a parent to NOT contribute to the ongoing problem. It’s the other shit, dumb-ass, irresponsible parents that NEED TO BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE.",
">\n\nLet me throw a hypothetical situation at you. Let's say you've gone through all the firearm safety lessons you can with your daughter. A few years later as a teenager she ends up getting bullied relentlessly at school and makes a horrible, hormone fueled mistake and takes a gun to school and shoots her bully. Do you still think you would need to be held accountable even though you tried to instill proper firearm education to her?",
">\n\nPresumably his guns are locked up. Any kid hell bent on shooting someone can find a gun, but this Virginia shooting is entirely the \"parents'\" fault.",
">\n\nThis is the point. In most first world countries they can't find a gun even if they are hell bent on shooting someone.",
">\n\nYou know what’s a guarantee in all of these cases? There were multiple warning signs, massive amounts of documentation from the teachers and possibly other personnel. You know what was done about it? Jack shit; because that’s what happens every time one of these goes on. \nIt’s a bureaucratic failure of the highest order just to baby our most vulnerable children without giving any real help.",
">\n\nIt’s too easy for all of those not blessed with experience in childhood education bureaucracy to just write you off as disgruntled parent/teacher/admin; people NEED to know how bullshit ineffectual the buck-passing is even in situations like this that will inevitably lead to one-of-those-kids-we-all-know harming themselves, another child or some other innocent. \nIn the current environment, those best able to sweep this bullshit under the rug advance to the ONLY positions empowered to do shit about it. Denial is killing children. Praying for zombie Robin Williams or Sid Poitier to arise and guide each child towards a safe path won’t help- no teacher has a phone booth and superhero cape. \nIt’s OK for your kid to rat on their wee playmate with a gun. I was five when I found the key, undid the trigger lock and tried to put 30-30 rounds I found in dad’s underwear drawer in the Luger I overheard was hidden in the shed. That Luger reeked of linseed oil and cosmoline and how the hell did I know that I should put bullets in a gun? My mom found me hiding under my covers with it and thank fuck the big rifle rounds didn’t fit, I hadn’t yet found the Winchester and dad had zero ammo for the Luger. But I had that pistol open and ready to load. I didn’t even hate anybody then-I loved my teachers. Thanks to my mom the guns left the house. \nI totally understand how a six year old could go from “teacher embarrassed me” to “gotta kill teacher.” I am shocked that more people don’t remember when they were six. Or recognize that some six year olds are scary clever. All you need to add to perfectly normal circumstances are gun and ammo. Could have been me at six. Some asshole’s going to blame the child seeing a hip hop video about “some bitch betray ya- ya know ya gotta spray her” but even if true, that’s the weakest fucking bullshit link in this chain of events. You limp dick second amendment motherfuckers just about killed that teacher, and half of you would have praised the teacher if they had been armed and blew away a three foot tall “bad guy.”",
">\n\nI'm sorry but this is horseshit. I was bullied relentlessly as a child by mostly children, but also some adults/teachers. I knew exactly where the guns were and how to load them at 6 years old and killing someone never even crossed my mind at that age.\nIt is extremely unnatural for a child that young to intentionally try to kill someone.",
">\n\nWhat makes you think every kid is like you at the same age ? There's a metric fuck ton of variables to take into account, but in the end of the day, having access to a firearm is what enables a person to use it in the first place",
">\n\nThe incredibly small number of incidents where a young child uses a gun to intentionally hurt someone. There have been like 16 instances in the past 20 years and while inaccessibility prevents it yes, I'd be willing to bet a ton that the RATE of 6 year olds with access to a gun INTENTIONALLY hurting someone with it is way lower than a 12 year old. Stupid people like this aren't hiding their guns for their 6 year old just to leave them around in later years.\nAll I'm saying is that it is EXTREMELY abnormal for a 6 year old to genuinely want to kill someone and then actually make a real attempt to do it. Apparently according to Reddit though, 6 year olds in America can easily go from upset to murderous.",
">\n\nWant to slow this down? Charge the owner of that weapon with assault with a deadly weapon, negligence, and whatever else someone who actually pulled the trigger would have been charged with. \nWe hear about “responsible gun ownership” all the time. Well, this was clearly irresponsible gun ownership as a 6 year old was able to get their hands on the weapon. So, let’s start holding those gun owners responsible for how their weapons are used regardless of if the weapon was in their possession or not.",
">\n\nI'm on board with this. My guns are in a safe and unloaded. I don't even have kids.",
">\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder? Isn’t the point of a gun to protect you at home?",
">\n\n\nWhat are you going to do if there’s an intruder?\n\nCall 911 and ensure that the intruder doesn't get a free gun, and the cops don't shoot me.",
">\n\nWhy have the gun?",
">\n\nSome people go to the range to shoot their guns, some people hunt.",
">\n\nHaving a gun with the intention to shoot on people is kind of scary.",
">\n\nYou all are talking about guns, but you're missing the point. Educators are not respected. They can't tell the truth about their community either. It's NEVER the kid's fault. It's NEVER the parent's fault. It's ALWAYS the teacher's or the school's fault. This country is going down because there is no accountability for being a parent, a student, or a member of a community\n*edit - as many of you pointed out, yes guns are a major problem. Guns make it easier to cause harm and there should be legislation to help. But guns or no guns, education in this country is crumbling",
">\n\n100% agreed. And if anyone here doesn’t, go sit in on some classes (especially middle school and high school), and see for yourself. Kids threaten teachers, hit them, hit each other, steal stuff, disrupt class, and each kid is ready to whip their phone out and record the teacher inevitably losing their temper, and then bam! All the teacher’s fault. \nI’ve seen it, lived it, have teacher friends living it now, and a teacher mother who lived it. Parents expect teachers to do all the parenting with none of the freedom of being a parent, and all the consequences of someone who shouldn’t even be near their kids.\nIt’s pretty bullshit, really.",
">\n\nI’m assuming there’s a correlation between being digital/social media natives and this behavior. I graduated public high school in 2010 and it was never, ever that bad. Obviously there were the hallway fights and kids mouthing off in class, but threatening a teacher would’ve gotten you an immediate suspension, at minimum.",
">\n\nMy husband said it was around 2012 or 2013 when he noticed things taking a turn for the worse. Before that, if he asked you to put your phone away, you might bitch about it while putting your phone away. Now, he'll get a \"fuck you. You can't stop me.\" Kids rarely get suspended for any phone related stuff.\nThis is just phones. Everything else, he said, has gotten worse as well.",
">\n\nCursing in class would have resulted in severe punishment in 2007 when I graduated. At least a one day suspension. Telling a teacher to fuck off over a cell phone would have been at least a week.",
">\n\nI have to say “please don’t use the F word in class” probably 8 times a day. I never ever ever changes, no matter how many times I ask, no matter how nicely I say it. And that’s all I’m allowed to do is ask; I can’t give any sort of consequence.",
">\n\nI’m genuinely asking so sorry if this comes off as rude, but why even bother asking at that point?",
">\n\nDoes anyone know where she was hit? All I can find is condition",
">\n\nIn Virginia?",
">\n\nI meant on the body",
">\n\nHer abdomen and her hand.",
">\n\nI'm sure the NRA position is every teacher, school staffer and student should be required to bring a gun to school.",
">\n\nImagine if a teacher shot a 6yo?\nWait, maybe it would get some attention.",
">\n\nThey'll suggest arming the kids to protect themselves against armed teachers who are protecting themselves against armed kids. There's no solution for these geniuses which doesn't involve yet more guns, for some reason."
] |
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