Datasets:

---

innovation-hacking2

/

shitposting_dataset1

like 0

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies…." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc)." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice)." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\"." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though.", ">\n\nIt's not... \nIts 3rd wave feminists that say it's sexist and what not but then mention their end goal in life is to have a husband that earns 2-400k a year so then don't have to work anymore 😂\nIf I had a wife making 6figures I would have no problem staying home with the kids and taking care of the house" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though.", ">\n\nIt's not... \nIts 3rd wave feminists that say it's sexist and what not but then mention their end goal in life is to have a husband that earns 2-400k a year so then don't have to work anymore 😂\nIf I had a wife making 6figures I would have no problem staying home with the kids and taking care of the house", ">\n\nFor me, Im not really sure what the selling point is. I guess there’s the whole “focus on raising the next generation” angle, which makes sense, but beyond that, what does a housewife/husband get out of doing house maintenance tasks? \nYou work to maintain a home someone else owns, raise some kids and get what? The satisfaction of having more attention to spend on them? Is that the totality of what you want to dedicate decades of your life to…? If it makes you happy, great but still it feels so… small a life to live to me…\nI feel more pity then disgust. Its a noble role, but its a huge self sacrifice, and for what? We have modern role organizations that allow both partners to pursue productive and fulfilling careers. Why throw all that away for this?" ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though.", ">\n\nIt's not... \nIts 3rd wave feminists that say it's sexist and what not but then mention their end goal in life is to have a husband that earns 2-400k a year so then don't have to work anymore 😂\nIf I had a wife making 6figures I would have no problem staying home with the kids and taking care of the house", ">\n\nFor me, Im not really sure what the selling point is. I guess there’s the whole “focus on raising the next generation” angle, which makes sense, but beyond that, what does a housewife/husband get out of doing house maintenance tasks? \nYou work to maintain a home someone else owns, raise some kids and get what? The satisfaction of having more attention to spend on them? Is that the totality of what you want to dedicate decades of your life to…? If it makes you happy, great but still it feels so… small a life to live to me…\nI feel more pity then disgust. Its a noble role, but its a huge self sacrifice, and for what? We have modern role organizations that allow both partners to pursue productive and fulfilling careers. Why throw all that away for this?", ">\n\nI love the fact that you completely turned the problem upside down. :D You get my upvote for it.\nThe problem of housewifes isn't that they are opressed. It's that they're using their partners instead of working." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though.", ">\n\nIt's not... \nIts 3rd wave feminists that say it's sexist and what not but then mention their end goal in life is to have a husband that earns 2-400k a year so then don't have to work anymore 😂\nIf I had a wife making 6figures I would have no problem staying home with the kids and taking care of the house", ">\n\nFor me, Im not really sure what the selling point is. I guess there’s the whole “focus on raising the next generation” angle, which makes sense, but beyond that, what does a housewife/husband get out of doing house maintenance tasks? \nYou work to maintain a home someone else owns, raise some kids and get what? The satisfaction of having more attention to spend on them? Is that the totality of what you want to dedicate decades of your life to…? If it makes you happy, great but still it feels so… small a life to live to me…\nI feel more pity then disgust. Its a noble role, but its a huge self sacrifice, and for what? We have modern role organizations that allow both partners to pursue productive and fulfilling careers. Why throw all that away for this?", ">\n\nI love the fact that you completely turned the problem upside down. :D You get my upvote for it.\nThe problem of housewifes isn't that they are opressed. It's that they're using their partners instead of working.", ">\n\nFine with this, as long as house-wives/house-husbands stop lying to themselves and everyone else about how “difficult” it is being a stay-at-home parent to kids that are in school most of the day, Monday to Friday. Housework and cooking meals is not hard, so stop trying to pretend that it is." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though.", ">\n\nIt's not... \nIts 3rd wave feminists that say it's sexist and what not but then mention their end goal in life is to have a husband that earns 2-400k a year so then don't have to work anymore 😂\nIf I had a wife making 6figures I would have no problem staying home with the kids and taking care of the house", ">\n\nFor me, Im not really sure what the selling point is. I guess there’s the whole “focus on raising the next generation” angle, which makes sense, but beyond that, what does a housewife/husband get out of doing house maintenance tasks? \nYou work to maintain a home someone else owns, raise some kids and get what? The satisfaction of having more attention to spend on them? Is that the totality of what you want to dedicate decades of your life to…? If it makes you happy, great but still it feels so… small a life to live to me…\nI feel more pity then disgust. Its a noble role, but its a huge self sacrifice, and for what? We have modern role organizations that allow both partners to pursue productive and fulfilling careers. Why throw all that away for this?", ">\n\nI love the fact that you completely turned the problem upside down. :D You get my upvote for it.\nThe problem of housewifes isn't that they are opressed. It's that they're using their partners instead of working.", ">\n\nFine with this, as long as house-wives/house-husbands stop lying to themselves and everyone else about how “difficult” it is being a stay-at-home parent to kids that are in school most of the day, Monday to Friday. Housework and cooking meals is not hard, so stop trying to pretend that it is.", ">\n\nIf the cooking is good, it is fair \nBut sometimes, the cooking is very lazy. \nEg. Ready made meal, air fry everything, cooking without seasoning / with lazy seasoning (random match of supermarket ready made sauce pack)." ]

[ "Not exactly the same, but I work as a housekeeper and gardener. I excelled in school and have a law degree, but physical work soothes my soul in a way that law and similar occupations never would.", ">\n\nI have worked in I.T for more years than I care to mention. Stick me in the garden to get on with jobs or decorating a room, build a BBQ. I much prefer this it's relaxing and very fulfilling.", ">\n\nMy friend has the same job and same hobbies. I think completing tasks you can't physically see an immediate reward for doesn't hit the same reward centres as the things you describe. Also the work is never done at work, where as physical things have a process to completion with an environment improvement as the goal?", ">\n\nI couldn't have put it better myself.", ">\n\nI think that the reason a lot of people warn young girls against aiming to become housewives is because they'll be completely financially dependent on a spouse which means it is extremely difficult to leave them if they are abusive/cheat or find a job if they die/lose their jobs etc. While I agree that being a house wife/husband is really underappreciated, it's really hard to get a high-paying job with such a large employment gap, most employers don't value the skills that house-spouses have. Even in the best relationships, unbalanced financial power can still cause issues. But I agree, housewives/husbands are just as crucial as working wives/husbands but it's also important that the the stay-at-home spouse has a way out/employable skill.", ">\n\nNot only if they divorce, but if the spouse dies….", ">\n\nEh--this happened to my family. You need to make sure that the working spouse is carrying a life insurance policy. It will bridge the gap for several years while the other spouse gets on their feet. I can say as someone that this actually happened to that this is not a reason to be too worried as long as you are able to prepare in this way. Also get one for the stay at home spouse because if they die you need instant childcare in many cases.", ">\n\nNot to mention if the other spouse had a decent job and was at all financially responsible they should have a good amount stashed in 401k’s, IRA’s, and savings to pass onto the other spouse.", ">\n\ndecent jobs don't pay enough anymore. you have to be rich to save anything.", ">\n\nNawh, im barely 26 and have a solid amount in my 401k with just 2.5 years of 11% contributions+a 4% match. \nThat account alone may be worth like 200k in just 10 years inflation already factored in. That’s a good chunk to allow a potential spouse time and resources to get back on their feet assuming i die early.\nNot even considering my IRA, and cash on hand.", ">\n\nThis is beyond most peoples means in today's economy.", ">\n\nNot if you have a decent job, which is the kicker my whole post relies on. And by decent i mean high 5 figures-low 6. Trust me i know people making 200k a year. They contribute upwards of 20-30%.\nEither way, About 50 some odd % of the country contributes to a 401k plan and the average out of pocket contribution is 7%, or 11% once a match is considered. It’s more common than you think, and 7-11% is honestly too little as is for a 65 retirement age and isn’t a whole lot. But definitely large enough to leave your spouse with a lot of money if you die young.", ">\n\nMy Mother in Law felt her career was being a housewife/stay-home-mom. \nWhen you listen to her talk about it, it clearly was a source of pride and fulfillment. \nWhen I tried being a Housewife my home became a prison.\nNo one should be forced into being a housewife/husband but there is absolutely nothing wrong with it if they feel fulfilled and/or content.", ">\n\nSame! I regret being by a full time SAHM. I wish I had at least kept one shift a week/every 2 weeks. I have felt so trapped the last 7 years. I love my kids and husband but I have no clue who I am as a person anymore. I would have done better with a balance of being at home and working.", ">\n\nI feel that “I have no clue who I am as a person anymore”\nHave you considered a job at a local (or your son’s) school? I know a lot of moms and one dad in a similar situation. Two became cafeteria workers and another a bus driver. Just an idea, hopefully a helpful one :)", ">\n\nThe cafeteria ladies have all been there for decades so barring death, no go there, lol!", ">\n\nMy mom is a housewife and while I never thought of it as shameful..the big issue is that like her, many housewives tend to be financially dependent on their husbands. I just know that if my mom had a job, she would’ve divorced my dad many years ago. My family is considered upper-middle class. Never had to worry about money and we’d go on expensive vacations every year. But money doesn’t always equal happiness. Being a housewife can lead to a very lonely life. Housework and childcare is basically a 24/7 job. Not much time for friends until your kids go off to college. My mom doesn’t have much friends and relies on my dad or me and my sis to spend a lot time with her. She relieves her stress through shopping but that’s really a short moment of happiness.", ">\n\nBeing financially dependent on someone else, especially as an adult, is always a risk. I know alimony exists but I've seen people whine about that too. It's also not easy to join the workforce again after leaving your job for an extended period of time. And your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own. \nAnd if I earn my own money, I can choose a partner I genuinely like rather than going for a rich man who earns enough to support our whole family on a single income.", ">\n\n\nAnd your spouse can die too and you'll be left to support yourself and your family on your own.\n\nif you have a family to support you're likely grappling with childcare costs which might end up being too expensive to handle, making it more cost-effective to just be a stay at home spouse", ">\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live. Cost of living such as rent, good schools etc is significantly more expensive than childcare.\nAnd there's a difference between having a job and a career. You can progress significantly with a career as and when kids grow up and save more money for college or just earn more in general in the future. However if it's a just a low paying job like retail or something (?) then yeah makes sense to leave.", ">\n\n\nChildcare isn't that expensive where I live.\n\nall I gotta say is... must be nice lol", ">\n\nI’m a trophy husband! Divorced so really bad at my job though", ">\n\nI hate that people think being a house wife/husband is just sitting on your ass all day after doing a couple chores, they deserve as much respect as everyone else. That said I wouldn't willingly be one. I feel like not enough people acknowledge that choosing to be in a situation where you rely on some else's income is a risk. Nobody expects their SO to cheat or become abusive but it's always a real possibility and if you have no job experience or college education from before you became a house spouse it's going to be very difficult to leave especially if you have kids. This is why I don't think being a housewife or house husband should be shamed or praised because you're putting yourself at risk and you have no money that you made yourself. I think one of the reasons divorce has gone up and is initiated by women more is because these days more women have an actual income and can leave when they need/want to.", ">\n\nIt's totally ok if it's what the person actually wants to do, it's only a problem if they are pushed/forced into it by their partner or societal expectations.", ">\n\nAdult not having their own money, has nowhere to go if marriage doesn’t work. Living on one income is miserable if other partner is not a top earner. It’s a way to abuse. The only thing I understand is when stay at home spayed has their own investment account with each month regular amount being put there as salary/pension plan. Also amount of money for escape strategy. Taking into account that if divorce happens they will not be able to find descent job with this hole in experience or education. I don’t want to be that miserable.\nAnd family of 4 with 1 breadwinner is extremely risky unstable structure. So much pressure on breadwinner", ">\n\nBut.. in theory, that breadwinner doesn’t need to lift a finger at home. So less pressure?", ">\n\nWhy do people think like this though? Raising a family/running a household is a 24/7 job. Why should the stay at home partner work days, evenings, nights and weekends while the breadwinner only puts in 40 hours a week?", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is a lot of work, especially if you have kids. That shit might even be more difficult than being some “girl boss ceo” because it’s literally a full time job- you don’t just go home because when you’re a housewife your home is your job. \nThey should be given more credit", ">\n\nI would say \"only\" if you have kids, if there's no kids, stay at home wife/husband would be piss easy and only fair if it is with the full agreement of the spouse.", ">\n\nWell yeah it depends on what everyone mutually agreed to do. And the size of the household. Maybe location. Lots of factors. But sometimes being a part of a company can be extremely easy. So yeah, many factors", ">\n\nIs it? Running a household is a full time job, more so if you have kids. If I'm ever in a position where my partner earns enough for the household, and it's needed, I'd be down for it. Especially if there's kids involved. My career interest can even be done at home largely.", ">\n\nBeing a housewife is not nearly as shameful as being a househusband, by orders of magnitude.", ">\n\nWhich it shouldn’t be but I see what you’re saying.", ">\n\nHouse husbands are very much appreciated", ">\n\nMy wife is a housewife. She works very hard to keep our house in order, care for our two babies, and make sure I’m taken care of as well. I’m a corporate attorney and provide for us financially 100%, but she is very much an equal partner. \nFor example: after my shower and getting dressed for work this morning I came out to see her filling out medical forms for our sons with one on her lap and my lunch and breakfast (plus a snack) and coffee for the day were already prepared on the counter. \nShe’s caring for twins all day after being up with them most of the night and keeping our house clean, the laundry done, etc. etc. She’s a rockstar and anyone who says housewives are lazy have no clue what they’re talking about.", ">\n\nIkr?! There is a lot of work, organization, daily tasks, accounting, and mental resilience that goes along with being a good homemaker in a family.", ">\n\nIf someone can afford to stay home sure do it. But if you have to depend on the government money, go to work.", ">\n\nBeing able to be financially independent is a good thing regardless if divorce or death ends the marriage. It’s extremely hard for someone to get back into the workforce after being out of it for an extended period of time. It also helps keep the financial power in the relationship more balanced.", ">\n\nI’m on leave right now with my 5 mth old son, can confirm that stay at home parent is the most difficult job I have ever done and I have a very demanding career. Major props to all the stay at home parents out there!", ">\n\nIt's weird to me that society wants to shame the people who get to chill around the house all day. Sounds like pure jealousy to me.", ">\n\nTaking care of kids and a household is not chilling all day. It’s that mentality that takes away the credibility of the work.", ">\n\ni think feeling the need to define it as work is just vanity, i think most parents would rather be at home raising their child than be at work. SAH is easily the more enviable position.", ">\n\nHave you done it though? The hours blur together, you have not a second to yourself, not even to get clean. There’s very little adult company to trade thoughts with. You survive from tantrum to nap time to when your partner gets home. If you get some energy when the baby or toddler is asleep you may get something cleaned. But more often you’re exhausted and getting sleep yourself or finally having a poo. If the child is older you’re always making and remaking snacks and meals and arguing and entertaining and wondering if it’s been too much screen time. Your weight creeps up because you finish all of their uneaten meals and they cried the last few walks you tried to do. The house is a mess, and you can’t find it in yourself to care because you are so tired and overwhelmed and then partner comes home and no you don’t get a break because they’ve been working all day too and now you have to work together to make dinner appear. I’m telling you that first walk out of the daycare of the first day after all of that… priceless!\nSitting at a desk all day with a nice structured lunch time and a walk and some chit chat is MUCH less work. Not to mentioned feeling fulfilled to be accomplishing something and contributing and not just someone’s mommy. I love my kids but it’s too much for all of us to be home together all day everyday. They need exposure to other people and kids too.", ">\n\nIdk why you’re getting downvoted for just sharing your experience, but thank you for giving your honest contribution to this discussion!\nI’ve been married for 6 years and will not go into motherhood lightly because of all the things you mentioned. Children are very difficult to be around 24/7. Pile all the housework, groceries, cooking, cleaning, etc….SAH parents work hard for little reward, and society still looks down on them. Raising children is a very important contribution to society.\nI hope you are doing well and if you’re still raising kids, that you find some time for yourself today :)", ">\n\nYah, those groups are all the same, freedom and bs unless your freedom doesn’t align with their agenda. My gf actually likes staying at home and having much more free time since we moved together, now she goes to the gym, started the courses she has been pursuing for years…", ">\n\nEmancipation isn't just about women fulfilling traditional male roles, it's about having the freedom to choose your own path as a woman. That includes a path as a housewife.\nIndividual freedom means that you can take your own decisions, but also that you're responsible for them. You want a career? Go for it! You want to stay at home and raise your kids instead of outsourcing them do a daycare? Go for it! Do what you want to do, as long as you don't harm others or infringe their own individual freedoms in the process.", ">\n\nYou're right. The problem happens though when you don't work for years, your husband (or wife) leaves you and you have nothing. You have no job, no work experience, just alimony (and that's not always a case). It's very risky to be a housespouse. Everyone makes their choice but damn, it's risky as hell. I know that people believe in love and that's great but nowadays around 50% of married couples get divorced.", ">\n\nwith the exception of special needs and suprise triplets i feel like choosing to be a SAH after the kid goes to school is a very telling personal choice, it says i wish to be taken care of. Plenty of households where both parents work, keep thier house in order and find time to raise their children well.", ">\n\nIdk, I am a man. It would be a dream come true if I could devote all my time and energy solely to being with my family at home. It is so sad that people feel shameful of such a blessing.", ">\n\nIt's not the shame, its the risk that most people don't want. Being totally dependent on someone to feed you and not having savings of your own in case things go south is not smart.", ">\n\nIf the woman wants divorce she can get like half everything the husband owns without lifting a finger. Yet men still take that risk of losing what they've collected and get married. I don't think what you said rely means too much.", ">\n\nIn how many countries is that true hun? It isn't that way in most countries. There's a whole world outside of your country.\nThe post didn't ask about a specific country, so you can't refute my answer with specifics about your country.\nAlso, if you were a house husband, you would get half in your country as well. So why did you make this about gender?", ">\n\nI am glad you brought this up. As I work with international people, Europeans and Americans, who have the most \"equal rights\" in marriage contracts are the ones who are the most depressed, divorced, and the ones who criticize stay at home parents the most.", ">\n\nMost people want more time with their families, especially parents.\nWe should be encouraging it and promoting it, not sidestepping it because work.", ">\n\nbecause *of work", ">\n\nits cause people constantly undervalue work done by women. you can see this with female dominated professions - teaching, nursing, etc.\nalso, people usually dont consider domestic work as actual labor when it clearly is. theres a great book on the subject called “who cooked the last supper?”", ">\n\nThe problem is letting yourself be completely dependent on someone else.\nI think it worked in past generations because men respected the arrangement and made enough money to pay all the bills.\nBut in the 70s and 80s that eroded and many women were cheated on/abused/abandoned financially. \nAfter that many woke up and saw what a trap they built for themselves. Independence became more important for women.", ">\n\nPeople should be able to do whatever they want to do, as long as they aren't hurting other people.", ">\n\nBeing a house husband is great, it means you have married a strong, powerful independent woman.\nBeing a housewife means you’ve gone along with the patriarchy. As long as you are aware that you’re making a decision that destroys society, then, fine, I guess.", ">\n\ndamn those mothers raising their kids! wont they think of SOCIETY?! (shakes fist at cloud)", ">\n\nExactly. It’s almost as if a lot of people on Reddit are 18 year olds in 101 courses with zero life experience hearing things for the first time then post about them unfiltered.", ">\n\nit's my dream job tbh.", ">\n\nSimple life advice stay out other people marriages", ">\n\nMy wife is a sahm mom and hasn't experienced any negativity", ">\n\nI don't think it's shameful, but these days I think it only really works if the other spouse has a very good income. With the cost of living these days, a single-income household doesn't go as far as it used to.", ">\n\nI support you, being a housewife is just as important as a job as anything else, sometimes more", ">\n\nyeah i think if there’s children then it’s pretty much a necessity to have someone at home, i’m a sahm and i can not imagine having to work and come home and clean and take care of babies and cook (cause let’s face it women almost always end up doing the majority anyway) i would lose my mind lol. but it just improves everyone’s quality of life", ">\n\nI don’t think it’s shameful, but it’s almost necessary to have both parties work in order to make ends meet (unless you’re some powerhouse earner-top5% etc).", ">\n\ni’m a SAHD and i hate it. it’s this way because my wife had a stable job and i lost my job. we had a kid and i’ve been taking care of the kid and the house. i want another kid but we can’t afford it on one income, and i can’t get a job because i’m taking care of the kid.\nthen add the social stigma of my wife taking care of me and not earning any money for myself. i’ve looked for WFH jobs but never found anything i can do.", ">\n\nOh I’m so sorry. How old is your child?", ">\n\nI don't think it is shameful. I think a lot of people have this belief. Don't they??", ">\n\nThere’a a growing movement right now where women have to be independent and strong. Can’t admit you’re lonely/want to pair up or that you dare want to stay home to take care of family. \nIt’s frighteningly similar to toxic masculinity tbh.", ">\n\nThe expectation to fulfill that role is oppressive. Refusing the option is equally oppressive.", ">\n\nLiberal women shame women over it and conservative men shame men over it...\nFun!", ">\n\nI can’t fathom why anyone would want to be dependent on someone else financially like that.", ">\n\nIf you want to be a house wife or a house husband than that's okay. Be whatever you want, you shouldn't have to explain yourself to anyone.", ">\n\nI think it’s all about choice, and no woman should be shamed for picking one or the other yknow? Personally, I have no interest in having a family and am very happy to be a career focused person. Cool, I have that choice. My mom on the other hand, absolutely loved being a SAHM and it gave her happiness that her career never did. And that was her choice. TDLR; judgement bad. Choice good.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM when our second child was born. I would never change it EVER! I loved being with my kids. I never had to worry about someone else keeping them. I never missed 1 school function. My husband and I decided that we could do without for the sake of our children. We didn’t need a big house or fancy cars. We made it just fine. There is absolutely no shame in it.", ">\n\nIf given the choice between kid duty vs a job, I think I would choose job.\nI would personally go crazy stuck at home all day with no adult interaction.", ">\n\nI think there needs to be a separation of kids at home and when kids go to school. Or even kids go to daycare while someone stays at home. Entirely different situations.\nMy stepmom doesn’t work and other than clean the house she basically does nothing. The kids do their own laundry. We eat out half of the week. She’s lazy.", ">\n\nSome people are just better homemakers. I totally agree. There’s a double standard with men I would like to see re-examined. It takes an especially independent and open minded woman to accept having a house husband.", ">\n\nI don't think most people's problems actually lie with being a housewife, it's the fact that it's pretty much expected of women. The pushback you're seeing isn't against the actual choice, it's pushback against the notion that they have to fall into that role. Nothing wrong with it if you enjoy it, but we can't pretend like we're not still living in a society which pressures women to fulfill the caretaker role regardless of their own wishes.", ">\n\nI've never heard of shaming folks who stay home.", ">\n\nUnpopular or not, 100% agreement. I love being a stay at home husband, I just like it, I enjoy cooking, looking after home, keeping everything ready as wife returns from work. I enjoy and am happy to work for my family rather than greezing my ass for some hospital/corporate shithole. I think this should be encouraged rather than be frowned upon (though obviously if it as per ones choice).", ">\n\nI've never understood the hate for these occupations. \n\"You cook for total strangers? Wow, you're a chef, that is so cool\".\n\" You cook for your loving family? Wow, you really let the patriarchy plow you down\". \nI've met a lot of housewives, and most of them are nicer to be around than plenty of people I've met who have a \"real job\".", ">\n\nOh, I don't think its shameful.\nBut, what I do have beef with, is when housewife/husbands try to equate their stress/workloads to what is managed by two working parents.\nIf you are a housewife/husband or you have a spouse that is a housewife/husband, I don't want to hear about how stressful your lives are with regards to managing time or work/life, etc. You don't get to complain about that to me or to my spouse.\nAnd in the same vane, I won't complain to you about the prices of things/inflation, etc. We have two incomes to absorb the cost of things.\nSome of chose money, some of us chose time.", ">\n\nI agree. What does a homemaker even do all day? My spouse and I both work full time and manage to take care of our home and children.", ">\n\nI love taking care of the house. Cooking, chilling, cleaning, doing laundry. It's my favourite thing.", ">\n\nThis sub should learn the difference between \n\n\nan unpopular opinion \n\n\nan opinion that is unpopular because you discuss it with very specific sets of people and ignore the lots who share the same opinion with you", ">\n\nI'm more valuable at home taking care of the house and farm than I ever would be standing behind the counter at some mega corporation chain store. My husband will openly admit to anyone that he wouldn't be where he is now without me supporting him at home and that should never be undermined by society.", ">\n\nThere's nothing shameful about it unless they're useless.\nIf my wife were to be a housewife but then I still had to do everything around the house, I'd be pissed off. But it's not like that - we both work, we both do chores.\nIf her work was at home, I would expect that when I'm off work she would be too.", ">\n\nI don't want to rely on other people's money nor do I want other people to rely on my money simple as that. I don't think there's anything wrong with being a house wife/husband but for me it's a loss of independence.", ">\n\nI just think it's not a good idea to be financially dependent on your spouse. Half of all marriages fail so just keep that in mind.", ">\n\nNot shameful - like \"hang your head.\" Counterintuitive - like \"what are you thinking?\"\nThe SAH role, freely chosen, can be both honorable and practical, as you say. Only it comes with risks. For the working spouse, divorce may be costly, but it poses no threat of abject poverty. But for the SAH spouse, divorce may be a dire prospect. So you have this imbalance of power, in which the SAH can find that they've become the lesser of two equals.\nI credit your father with earning mum's confidence to the degree that this choice requires. Or perhaps she just rolled the dice and got a seven. Sometimes the choice is made when confidence is well-earned, and sometimes it's made while wearing rose-colored glasses.", ">\n\nI think it depends entirely on whether the couple has children or not. Stay at home parent, admirable. Stay at home spouse with no actual substantive responsibilities, lame.", ">\n\nIf we abstract gender out of the equation for a moment, I would argue that in a family one parent should stay home and care for the house, the children et cetera.\nBut back to reality - the patriarchy can't have men doing those things. It needs men, its primary enforcers, to dominate the workforce, it needs them to be worn down and unthinking. I'm being deliberately provocative here, but hopefully you all see my point. \nLikewise, as most female feminists will tell you, it can't have women in the workforce - I won't speak for them, since I am not them. \nSo, we all know that saying someone should stay home would equate to women being denied careers. I'd happily be a stay-home dad, spend my days fixing up the broken shell of a building that my landlord rents to me, cooking, cleaning and the works - but the final nail in the coffin is that for a large section of society in most western countries the idea of living on a single income is merely a pipe dream.", ">\n\nI became a SAHM in my 30s when we discovered the only daycare for infants in my area closed just before I gave birth. The next was 45min away, as opposed to 5min, from my work and more expensive. After crunching numbers, we realized my entire paycheck plus would go to daycare and someone else would be raising my baby. \nSo, with trepidation, I quit Corporate America. \nStayed home for a decade, had two kiddos, and felt guilty for one year. Then I woke up to how lucky we were that we barely suffered, no steak dinners every night lol, and I raised our own kids. Had so much fun after that. When the youngest started 1st grade I went back to work part-time and full-time when they became a teenager. \nYes, it was very nice to have two incomes again, but neither of us would trade how it worked out. It was a blessing in disguise when that daycare closed. \nMy old job gave 6 weeks maternity leave, but when my baby turned that age I couldn't imagine leaving that tiny baby with strangers. That was my biggest takeaway. \nThe worst SAHM shamers were a couple of girlfriends, now ex friends. One called me a Stepford Wife and proceeded to Mean Girl me for decades. We haven't been friends for years, but that didn't stop her from getting a jab in every time she saw me around town. All the while being sugar sweet to the rest of my family. What a relief when they finally saw her true colors. \nIf you are financially forced into being a SAHM, make the best of it.", ">\n\nBeing a househusband sounds amazing to me tbh", ">\n\nFor the majority of people, housewifery is in fact oppressive and a function of other economic and social realities. Kudos to those who want to hold that role and are able to, though.", ">\n\nIt's not... \nIts 3rd wave feminists that say it's sexist and what not but then mention their end goal in life is to have a husband that earns 2-400k a year so then don't have to work anymore 😂\nIf I had a wife making 6figures I would have no problem staying home with the kids and taking care of the house", ">\n\nFor me, Im not really sure what the selling point is. I guess there’s the whole “focus on raising the next generation” angle, which makes sense, but beyond that, what does a housewife/husband get out of doing house maintenance tasks? \nYou work to maintain a home someone else owns, raise some kids and get what? The satisfaction of having more attention to spend on them? Is that the totality of what you want to dedicate decades of your life to…? If it makes you happy, great but still it feels so… small a life to live to me…\nI feel more pity then disgust. Its a noble role, but its a huge self sacrifice, and for what? We have modern role organizations that allow both partners to pursue productive and fulfilling careers. Why throw all that away for this?", ">\n\nI love the fact that you completely turned the problem upside down. :D You get my upvote for it.\nThe problem of housewifes isn't that they are opressed. It's that they're using their partners instead of working.", ">\n\nFine with this, as long as house-wives/house-husbands stop lying to themselves and everyone else about how “difficult” it is being a stay-at-home parent to kids that are in school most of the day, Monday to Friday. Housework and cooking meals is not hard, so stop trying to pretend that it is.", ">\n\nIf the cooking is good, it is fair \nBut sometimes, the cooking is very lazy. \nEg. Ready made meal, air fry everything, cooking without seasoning / with lazy seasoning (random match of supermarket ready made sauce pack).", ">\n\nOk bigot. Women aren't slaves made to stay at home. There's literally nothing more fulfilling that a woman can do than make powerpoints for a $60k a year" ]