Datasets:

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innovation-hacking2

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shitposting_dataset0

like 0

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones)." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\"." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble ." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of.", ">\n\nHow much Turkey is getting:" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of.", ">\n\nHow much Turkey is getting:", ">\n\nMaybe send that money to Turkey instead" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of.", ">\n\nHow much Turkey is getting:", ">\n\nMaybe send that money to Turkey instead", ">\n\nMaybe let´s try to prevent a full scale war in Europe first." ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of.", ">\n\nHow much Turkey is getting:", ">\n\nMaybe send that money to Turkey instead", ">\n\nMaybe let´s try to prevent a full scale war in Europe first.", ">\n\nThat’s not gonna happen" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of.", ">\n\nHow much Turkey is getting:", ">\n\nMaybe send that money to Turkey instead", ">\n\nMaybe let´s try to prevent a full scale war in Europe first.", ">\n\nThat’s not gonna happen", ">\n\nThey said the same thing about every major war in Europe" ]

[ "Damn. That is huge. More than €1000 per capita", ">\n\nNorway makes around €130-190 bn per year on oil and gas. €60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices. We should give €7.3bn each year, if not more.\nSource.", ">\n\n\n€60bn more in 2022 than in 2021 due to the soaring gas prices.\n\nWait…according to esteemed Reddit experts in commodity trading that would mean Norway is price gouging.", ">\n\nNo entity on earth has the ability to raise or lower commodity prices, except possibly OPEC (even though member states are constantly cheating on their production quotas), especially not a country which produces slightly more than 2% of the world's oil.", ">\n\nThat would affect the price at the forecourt though", ">\n\nIt’s amazing to me that Norway is proposing this when I read that the population of Norway is less than the population of Minnesota (Minnesota 5.7M, Norway 5.4M).", ">\n\nNorway has the world's largest sovereign wealth fund, providing a value of roughly $250,000 per Norwegian. They dumped all the surplus profits from their huge oil and gas reserves into it.\nThat 7 billion is pocket change for them", ">\n\nMan the Scandinavian countries are lucky huh. Peaceful area full of natural resources", ">\n\nPeaceful because we decided to stop fighting each other. No luck involved.", ">\n\nYes but that decision has been made centuries ago. Or am I wrong", ">\n\nThat decision is made every day ;)", ">\n\nI thought it the enduring peace has been possible because you’re culturally similar to each other and share a considerable amount of history and genes", ">\n\nOh hell no. We've been fighting like mad for hundreds of years.", ">\n\nFighting like fighting over who’s songs are better or fighting like Russians with Ukrainians?", ">\n\nFuck yeah Norway", ">\n\nIk its a complicated situation but I’m not so sure funding war deserves a fuck yeah", ">\n\nAlright don’t help Ukraine, let Russia take over", ">\n\nYou don’t support negotiating a peaceful resolution?", ">\n\nNo - I support Ukraine getting all of its people back and Russia getting zero stolen land and abducted children.\nSome things are worse than war. An unjust peace is worse. Slavery is worse. Autocracy is worse. I've seen such things with my own eyes.", ">\n\nBriton is also working on a 5 year aid supply to Ukraine.", ">\n\nWhat, a single Briton? Wow.", ">\n\nHope it isn't Liz Truss", ">\n\nAre you British?", ">\n\nNope, her failure is pretty well known internationally however.", ">\n\nThis coming a week after the press release of Norway buying new Leo2A7+ tanks to replace their aging Leo2A4NOs, pretty sure those will be ukranian a year from now.", ">\n\nI think it's pretty telling that this is a multi-year commitment. Could be that the sentiment among many nations is this war will extend longer than being openly discussed.", ">\n\nEven if it ended tomorrow, they would still need massive help to rebuild. For a long time.", ">\n\nThat's a lot of fucking money even for a large GDP nation. WTF Norway!", ">\n\nProbably all that extra oil money they are getting still kudos to Norway", ">\n\nThat's some real money, if the rest of europe proportionately would do the same, it would be profound.", ">\n\nIn my eyes it’s a good mix of good policy and plain luck. \nOne thing is Norway being lucky with our natural reserves, especially oil, in relation to our population. Another lucky coincidence is the less known story of the IIRC former oil minister of Irak, who’d seen first hand how an oil industry completely controlled by the government led to the regime of Saddam Hussein, had fled said regime - to Norway - where he contacted the government just as they found oil and warned them not to go full private or state ownership/control over the industry. This led to Norway going for a hybrid model where the state and privately owned companies keep each other in check.", ">\n\nBuy shit for small funds or soldiers directly. Big funds like Prytula's fund or \"Come back alive\" are also not controlled by government and are considered trustworthy.", ">\n\nThanks! That's the answer I was looking for.", ">\n\nI disagree with your position about \"corrupt and ungrateful\" and think it's still useful to support this government. But if you think so and still want to help, yeah, there's your answer. Just wanted to clarify.", ">\n\nI am yet to find one which cannot be described as corrupt and ungrateful in general. As far as Ukrainian government, I've noticed a wave of anti-corruption news headlines these weeks. And Zelensky made it very clear back in summer that he doesn't appreciate my contributions to UAF.", ">\n\nHow so?", ">\n\nBy instigating a massive anti-Russian campaign.", ">\n\nSurely you can recognise that it’s not aimed at you? If you know you’re not part of the problem (indeed, by donating you’re part of the solution instead!), I’d think it’s pretty easy, cognitively, to exclude yourself as a target?\nThat being said, if you’re uncomfortable with U24, you can always donate to smaller groups of soldiers directly (like a particular battalion), or humanitarian efforts like the World Kitchen. This has been my choice, for example, when I’ve made donations - I like to be able to see my efforts make a difference directly (I have donated to a few drone groups for them fundraising to make bulk amounts of the FPV ones).", ">\n\nIs there a particular reason or historical context that the scandinavian countries invest(ed) in the \"Iron curtain\" nations? I came across something like that when I first read the Girl with the dragon tattoo series many years ago and did some basic googling but did not find out much.", ">\n\nI don't have the answer you're probably looking for, but Norway in particular creates a sort of soft global power by donating a lot to humanitarian projects. You can also notice a lot of the leadership in global organizations are Norwegian or Scandinavian as well. The Nobel peace price is awarded in Norway, the head of NATO is a former Norwegian prime minister, Jagland comes to mind as well.\nThere are people arguing that this is a way for Norway to stay relevant and to get a voice in the world, when the population consists of only 5m people. The Norwegian sovereign pension fund holds 1.4% of all the worlds listed companies on average, this also plays a role in maintaining some soft power.", ">\n\nAnd don't forget Jan Egeland, the \"United Nations Superhero Man\".", ">\n\nEgeland! 👏👏\nEgeland! 👏👏", ">\n\nJa!", ">\n\nThey might not have piles of military gear to send like Poland but they do have piles of money.", ">\n\nNorway just gave 8 leopard 2 tanks.", ">\n\nHe’s doing the mr beast pose", ">\n\nhuge for a small country.", ">\n\nWell done Norway! Class act.", ">\n\nShowing other countries how it’s done. Nice to see", ">\n\nNorway is fucking awesome.", ">\n\nCorrupt politicians are just going to steal it again", ">\n\nJust a quick question from someone who is still young and not invested in politics.\nwill ukraine have to pay back all the aid it gets from other nations?,my understanding of aid and weapons \"donations\" is that the nation needs to pay back their \"debt\", what i am thinking is something like the greece crises.\nand if not, aren't those the people taxes? Doesn't that affect other governments in the long run?\nPlease note i am still 17 and kinda sheltered from the world", ">\n\nWhatever Norwegian grants that go to Ukraine will not have to be paid back but they might come with demands of anti-corruption work or pro-democratic goals being met but the situation is very different for Norway right now because of how much money is coming in from gas as a direct result of this war.", ">\n\n\nsoaring electricity and food prices.\n\nImagine how bad it is in Ukraine.", ">\n\nSend it to Turkey instead.", ">\n\nNo.", ">\n\n💀", ">\n\nhow much is the cocaine budget", ">\n\nNorway 🇳🇴 has been a busy country. Saving away all this time. The total reconstruction package will be in trillions to be sure", ">\n\nLol why would you pledge so much when Ukraine has openly said hey we’re having corruption issues. Somebody’s definitely getting a new boat", ">\n\nUnlike America it’s not expected that contractors vastly overcharge based on political contributions or kickbacks. We call it corruption in other countries. In America, it’s just being a good businessperson.", ">\n\nYeh but Ukraine is literally firing higher ups for not using funds properly. That has nothing to do with the u.s. we didn’t say here’s some tanks and btw go buy a Porsche on us", ">\n\n5 years huh. Will there be a Ukraine in 5 years? Maybe sending all of it now, then nothing for the next 4 years would be more useful.", ">\n\nUnderstated point. The war is already about a year in. Given the recent losses idk if there will be a Ukraine in 5 years unless the west makes major moves.", ">\n\nIf the west wants Ukraine to win they can just decide to do it, there is so much more they can do but the trick is to not do more than Russia still feels it can win with a conventional war.", ">\n\nI think we should (with the permission of Ukraine) conduct a training exercise. A exercise where a few hundred thousand NATO troops occupy all of the land West of the Dnipro and conduct troop training. You know stuff like how to employ a Abrams tank, aerial refueling, combat medical training, river patrols, building a airfield and barracks, all the basics.", ">\n\nJust do it. You can afford, with all the petrol gains of last year. It would be a great symbolic gesture.", ">\n\nPretty sure handing over a couple billion in aid is a lot more than just symbolic.", ">\n\nYes, true. Apparently a lot of readers feel insulted with my description;( But hey, let's face it: 10316 billion NOK estimated profit in 2022, 1028 billion extra NOK net cashflow compared to 2021 due to war price of petrol and gas. Not Norways fault, of course. Source norskpetroleum.no. For € divide NOK by 11, that makes +/- 93,45 billion€= 99 billion$ EXTRA PROFIT IN ONE YEAR (2022 compared to 202)1. So 7,3 billion in 5 years? For Ukraine it's certainly no peanuts. But for Norway? Facts are facts. Yeah, yeah, it comes on top of the rest.", ">\n\nCrazy to think US has already given more then all the other countries combine for aid . Talk about being Ukraine’s sugar daddy, no wonder why the president is always talking to daddy Biden about needing more . I’m sure Reddit agree this is a good move , I just wonder how the other population feel about it. Not just the republicans but the people outside of this bubble .", ">\n\nChild’s play. USA have over 100 fucking billion in the past year. You’d think we have healthcare over here or something.", ">\n\nYou realise the scale difference in population size, yes?", ">\n\nYou realize I don’t care, yes? It’s a statement on the willingness of the US to never hesitate when it comes to spending money on killing people.", ">\n\nI think that the amount should have been at least $12 billion. Since Norway isn‘t an EU member, it doesn‘t contribute to the EU‘s budgets for Ukraine, as far as I know.", ">\n\nSorry, but I think that €14.5 million isn’t noteworthy. I think that Norway should have contributed at least €145 million to the European Peace Facility.\nAccording to the EU’s press release, the Norwegian government announced on Oct 31 its decision to support EUMAM Ukraine with a voluntary financial contribution of NOK 150 million (about €14.5 million) to the European Peace Facility.", ">\n\nThey aren´t obligated to give Ukraine a penny. Ukraine should be happy to accept anything", ">\n\nWell done Sweden!!!\nThats something to be proud of.", ">\n\nHow much Turkey is getting:", ">\n\nMaybe send that money to Turkey instead", ">\n\nMaybe let´s try to prevent a full scale war in Europe first.", ">\n\nThat’s not gonna happen", ">\n\nThey said the same thing about every major war in Europe", ">\n\nYet norwegian families can’t afford to buy food anymore if they are disabled/sick/out of work. They give the minimum, and that means: no dinners." ]

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[ "the coast guard are the ones actually putting a dent in trafficking.\nif you want to hate ice even more look into how they target small businesses for employing latines." ]

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[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together..." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here..." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think", ">\n\nThat's a good point. That's a distinct 3rd possibility. I'll add it." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think", ">\n\nThat's a good point. That's a distinct 3rd possibility. I'll add it.", ">\n\nIncome of families or individuals is not a result of inherited wealth. For most people (black and white) Income is very much what they earn from work. Of course if you’re unskilled and uneducated your income will be very low. In many cases there will not be any income to speak of. \nMost people, white, Asians or other, get education and start working in their profession. With time, they make progress, get promoted and are paid higher salaries. That is the income of majority of population. As a matter of fact many highly paid people, grew up in low income or poor families.\nFor example an Asian family I know, own a couple of properties they inherited. But that’s not what they are living off. A couple of them are employed in well paying jobs and two other own businesses: one is a doctor with a clinic and another - a lawyer who is associate at a lawyer firm. None of them live off the buildings they inherited. That money is saved." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think", ">\n\nThat's a good point. That's a distinct 3rd possibility. I'll add it.", ">\n\nIncome of families or individuals is not a result of inherited wealth. For most people (black and white) Income is very much what they earn from work. Of course if you’re unskilled and uneducated your income will be very low. In many cases there will not be any income to speak of. \nMost people, white, Asians or other, get education and start working in their profession. With time, they make progress, get promoted and are paid higher salaries. That is the income of majority of population. As a matter of fact many highly paid people, grew up in low income or poor families.\nFor example an Asian family I know, own a couple of properties they inherited. But that’s not what they are living off. A couple of them are employed in well paying jobs and two other own businesses: one is a doctor with a clinic and another - a lawyer who is associate at a lawyer firm. None of them live off the buildings they inherited. That money is saved.", ">\n\nAren't there more whites on welfare than blacks? Can you link me to your stat" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think", ">\n\nThat's a good point. That's a distinct 3rd possibility. I'll add it.", ">\n\nIncome of families or individuals is not a result of inherited wealth. For most people (black and white) Income is very much what they earn from work. Of course if you’re unskilled and uneducated your income will be very low. In many cases there will not be any income to speak of. \nMost people, white, Asians or other, get education and start working in their profession. With time, they make progress, get promoted and are paid higher salaries. That is the income of majority of population. As a matter of fact many highly paid people, grew up in low income or poor families.\nFor example an Asian family I know, own a couple of properties they inherited. But that’s not what they are living off. A couple of them are employed in well paying jobs and two other own businesses: one is a doctor with a clinic and another - a lawyer who is associate at a lawyer firm. None of them live off the buildings they inherited. That money is saved.", ">\n\nAren't there more whites on welfare than blacks? Can you link me to your stat", ">\n\nBlack subculture doesn't help. \nAnd Alfonzo Rachel pointed out that socialist politicians harvest votes from the black community, but then hinder free market capitalism in improving life for that community." ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think", ">\n\nThat's a good point. That's a distinct 3rd possibility. I'll add it.", ">\n\nIncome of families or individuals is not a result of inherited wealth. For most people (black and white) Income is very much what they earn from work. Of course if you’re unskilled and uneducated your income will be very low. In many cases there will not be any income to speak of. \nMost people, white, Asians or other, get education and start working in their profession. With time, they make progress, get promoted and are paid higher salaries. That is the income of majority of population. As a matter of fact many highly paid people, grew up in low income or poor families.\nFor example an Asian family I know, own a couple of properties they inherited. But that’s not what they are living off. A couple of them are employed in well paying jobs and two other own businesses: one is a doctor with a clinic and another - a lawyer who is associate at a lawyer firm. None of them live off the buildings they inherited. That money is saved.", ">\n\nAren't there more whites on welfare than blacks? Can you link me to your stat", ">\n\nBlack subculture doesn't help. \nAnd Alfonzo Rachel pointed out that socialist politicians harvest votes from the black community, but then hinder free market capitalism in improving life for that community.", ">\n\nCan you give an example of socialist politicians hindering free market capitalism in the black community?\nBlack subculture?" ]

[ "\"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\"\nIn the 1970s there were many Vietnamese boat people that arrived in the United States. They were quite literally foreigners, did not know the language, had NOOOO money, and about 18 years later a number of valedictorians at Southern California High Schools had last names like Ng or Nyguen. In one generation, there were children of Vietnamese boat people that became doctors and lawyers. From prestigious schools.\nClearly if America has deep racism this would be impossible. How did they do it? Well, their families stayed intact with both parents. They lived in very small apartments, or multiple families would live in one house with individual families sharing one bedroom. And those families vauled education and pushed their children to do well in school knowing that education was the path to prosperity.\n\" it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\"\nThen why are the people of Appalachia generationally poor? They are White, why is their income on average about the same as Black Americans? I will ask that question again, why are Appalachians that largely come from broken homes with absent fathers, high drug use, and without a big cultural push to educate their children out of poverty have wealth about the same as Black Americans?\nIn the United States, if you A)graduate from high school (and can do high school math, and read at a high school level), and B)get married before you make babies, and C)stay married, then you will not be poor. Approximately 97% of the people that do those steps are not poor in America.\nLack of wealth especially the lack of being able to build wealth from one generation to another has more to do with poverty, and the things that cause poverty, than then things related to race. The Vietnamese boat people proved that it is possible to THRIVE in the United States, by adopting cultural attitudes opposite of poverty.\nSo, when you say \"But many people say slavery and segregation, though wrong and evil, are not to blame for racial disparities. I don't understand the logic behind this.\" There is your answer.", ">\n\nI think one question to ask is \"did the coping mechanisms available to a group facing hardships having lasting utility?\" With that question in mind, it becomes clear that the coping mechanisms available to Black people (eg, don't excel or you'll get sold and separated from your family, you may have to act violently to protect yourself, etc) were harmful to them in the long term. A lot of norms/behaviors formed during slavery still exist in some form today (sugar/fat in most cooking; appreciation of physical ability, etc), and they are now counter-productive. \nCompare this to Jews, whose coping mechanisms after the Holocaust allowed for education and going into business (they were often limited to jewelry and banking), but where the general coping mechanisms from that time are extremely useful into today's world. \nSame with immigrants/Asians. \nYour Appalachia example fits this as well. What coping mechanisms were available to them? Not good education. Not saving money (with the \"company stores). Not improving their communities (extractive capitalism). They had booze, drugs, and sex available to them. The only coping mechanism that worked was to leave all together...", ">\n\nIf the Appalachia example fits here then that undercuts that poverty is based upon rascism from the OP.", ">\n\nI think there can be many reasons for poverty. Economic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism contributing to poverty among Blacks.", ">\n\nWhen the Title is:\n\nThe disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\n\n​\nAnd your answer is \"there can be many reasons for poverty.\"\nAnd additionally\n\nEconomic and educational factors contributing to poverty in Appalachia doesn’t negate those same factors plus racism\n\nThen you are conceding my point.\nthe OP was not \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of a bunch of economic factors that also plague Appalachia and also slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nIt was \"The disparity between the average white family income and the average black family income are the result of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking and the long term effects of slavery, segregation, and racist lawmaking\"\nThe fact that there is a sizable cohort of white Americans that have a similar average family income as black families is evidence that it was not slavery, nor segregation, nor racist lawmaking as the reason.", ">\n\nI think you actually conceded the OP’s point when you moved away from average to sub-set. :-)", ">\n\nWhile I don’t disagree with the opinion that the way people were treated in the past affects , or is it effects? , future generations , there are lots of other factors involved \nWhat about immigrants and refugees that arrive in the US with nothing ?\nAnd a few years later are earning a good living and own a home ?", ">\n\nAffects = Verb, Effects = Noun. You had it right.", ">\n\n\nEssentially because they started with zero once freed, they were and will never be able to catch up. Even if they earned the same returns as everyone else, they will still never catch up\n\nIsn't that what reparations would seek to address? I have mixed feelings about it, but I think one of the ideas behind reparations is that it would shrink that gap that otherwise can never be shrunk.", ">\n\nReparations is a varied to the point of depending on who you are talking to. \nI more wanted to highlight that if we kept everything 100% even moving forward, black family's will not bridge the wealth gap.", ">\n\nWhat about other minorities? Asians? Native Americans? Indians?", ">\n\nThe asian and Indian populations in the US are fairly recent. A majority of asian americans can be traced to post ww2 policy shifts in immigration where the US encouraged wealthy Asian families to immigrate. It's unfair for the US to try and take credit when people made their money elsewhere.\nIndian Americans are more recent but similar. The population of Indian Americans have tripled in the last decade along.", ">\n\n\n70% of black babies are born out of wedlock. \n\nIs that a bad thing? Is it important for people to get married?", ">\n\nYou realize that's not the same right? Just because you're not married doesn't mean you are a single parent family.", ">\n\n\nBlack families have a serious problem with single motherhood (parenthood).\n\nAnd you believe this is because of some inherent quality of black people?", ">\n\nI already explained where I believe that comes from.\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\nskeet skeet skeet. \"Yeah I fucked that bitch. She better not say she pregnant. That ain't my damn baby\". \nAnd the whole giving a lot more welfare to women who don't marry the babies father. Making it far more likely that they break up before the child is an adult.", ">\n\n\nPerverse incentives and bad culture.\n\nThat just leads me to ask the same question. Why do they have perverse incentives and bad culture? Do you believe it is because there is something inherently different about black people?", ">\n\nperverse incentive affect everyone the same way. They just have way more welfare recipients. But believe me I saw plenty of white people milking the system in my day. Ain't nothing special about black people in that regard.\nBlack culture.... I dunno. Maybe it's genetic. Maybe it's a remnant of the segregation and slavery past. Maybe it's both.\nYou know my Drill Sergeants (6 black 2 white 3 hispanic). Had an anti racist course they taught us in basic training. In the US Army. This was 2003. You know what they said? This will sound super racist to you but this was taught by black drill sergeant. He said the reason black people are so good at sports. Is because of the selection pressures that the slavers had on the black population. They wanted very strong durable slaves. That is how you get 75% black NBA and 80% black NFL. I don't know if how true that is. But yeah food for thought. It would still be racism/segregation/slavery. But in a different way.", ">\n\nCan you explain more about how welfare is affecting black people?\nI can tell you right now that people of different races actually have very minimal genetic differences to show for it. Therefore likely is as OP Is saying, and that it is due to our racist history.\nAnd your sergeant was definitely wrong about black people being bred for sports and that being why there are so many black athletes. How do I know that he is wrong? Because just a few decades ago the demographics were very different for sports. It was largely Jews who were the star athletes. What probably is more likely is that whatever minority faces the most difficulties looks to sports both as a therapeutic outlet and the way they can potentially make money.", ">\n\nThe poverty rate for Black married families is in the single digits: 7.2%. The poverty rate of unmarried Black mothers is almost 30%.\n​\nMost of Black poverty comes from unmarried Black people, mainly single moms. Almost 70% of black kids are born out of wedlock today. The majority of Black poverty today is caused by Black people choosing to have kids before they are married. \n​\nAnother seldom talked about factor in Black poverty is the average age of Black people when they first marry. In 2010, the average age when a Black couple first got married at was 30 years old. This is significantly higher than White couples at about 26-27 years old. White people usually get a head start on building wealth as a family. \n​\nThe disparity in White and Black income is due to tons of factors. The relevant question is: what is the easiest way to get the most Black people out of the poverty? The best answer seems to be encouraging Black couples to marry earlier or at least wait until they are married to have kids.", ">\n\nSo we don’t have any of that anymore, so why is the disparity still here", ">\n\n\nIn my view, it's clear that slavery and segregation had long lasting effects that have lead to the disparities we see today.\n\nIn my view it's absolutely not clear at all. What's the evidence for this?\n\nI don't understand the logic behind this. \n\nThe rule 1 of statistics is: correlation does not imply causation. So I literally don't understand the logic of people who just from seing a correlation immediately derive a conclusion. If you do that, you are doing it wrong. That's the case for e.g. gender wage gap too.\nSo in absence of evidence I don't believe in that claim. \nThat doesn't necessarily mean I believe some opposite claim. But you can look e.g. Thomas Sowell who makes the case that the reason for this whole thing is social policy; the black people were doing quite well before 1960's, even faced with segregation. Walter Williams makes similar cases: the free market actually eliminated a lot of racism by itself, black people were actually getting better. In the first half of 20th century. \nIn the end: most people today didn't get anything from their ancestors who lived 100 years ago. You may make the case that slavery is responsible for the black culture that ultimately leads to what we see today. But then, you always find \"somebody\" to blame for your problems, wouldn't you? In the meantime the asians just went to work and are doing fine.", ">\n\nDr Umar a black activist with a doctorate degree compares financial priorities of the average white family compared to the average black family. He himself explains how black america spent 2 billion dollars on air jordans, 4B on liqour and alcohol, 600M on fast food, and twice the amount of mercedes benz as white america. So the question becomes what is it the benz that makes it so attractive to the black community when they can't or barely afford it. It's a status symbol. The average black family is buying status symbols when they can barely afford to. While the average white family is not. To the degree where they are spending twice as much than a middle-class white family. If your own can't change your mind because it comes with accountability than you have already refused to change views before even making this post.", ">\n\n\nblack families had 0 wealth to pass down... it only makes sense to me that the next generation and generations after that would still be feeling the effects\n\nCounterpoint- there were immigrants that came here with literally the clothes on their backs, and that made a good living within a generation or two. So, it is possible.", ">\n\nthe half of my family that came from Ireland came with nothing but a single steamer trunk, that we still have in the family. they did not have money, in fact our last name was changed to be more \"Americanized\" at Ellis island. Part of my family fought for the union in the civil war too.\nWe are not rich by any means, in fact my mother was dirt poor and my dad was a military brat. his father ended up doing well but devoiced my dad's mother and basically left nothing to our half of the family. \nmy parents climbed their way to the middle class, and i'm working on doing the same.\nmaybe being white helped, maybe not, after all the Irish were not considered white back when my family came over here...", ">\n\nThe conflicting perspectives of W.E.B. Debois and Booker T. Washington really illustrates the evolution of black America in a few different ways.\nBefore the Civil Rights era black people seemed to hold to the perspective of Washington, and adopted the Debois view afterwards.", ">\n\nI think it’s more that the north is more racist than people think", ">\n\nThat's a good point. That's a distinct 3rd possibility. I'll add it.", ">\n\nIncome of families or individuals is not a result of inherited wealth. For most people (black and white) Income is very much what they earn from work. Of course if you’re unskilled and uneducated your income will be very low. In many cases there will not be any income to speak of. \nMost people, white, Asians or other, get education and start working in their profession. With time, they make progress, get promoted and are paid higher salaries. That is the income of majority of population. As a matter of fact many highly paid people, grew up in low income or poor families.\nFor example an Asian family I know, own a couple of properties they inherited. But that’s not what they are living off. A couple of them are employed in well paying jobs and two other own businesses: one is a doctor with a clinic and another - a lawyer who is associate at a lawyer firm. None of them live off the buildings they inherited. That money is saved.", ">\n\nAren't there more whites on welfare than blacks? Can you link me to your stat", ">\n\nBlack subculture doesn't help. \nAnd Alfonzo Rachel pointed out that socialist politicians harvest votes from the black community, but then hinder free market capitalism in improving life for that community.", ">\n\nCan you give an example of socialist politicians hindering free market capitalism in the black community?\nBlack subculture?", ">\n\nWhite folks didn't force black folks to build a multimillion-dollar rap industry glorifying gang violence and calling each other the N-word. And how is it white people's fault when dark-skinned adolescents drop out of school? And rioting isn't a good way to impress white employers.\nReparations is nonsense. A hard worker doesn't use a history book as an excuse to demand handouts.\nMartin Luther King told a church in St. Louis, \"We have to do something about our moral standards. ...We can't keep on blaming the white man. There are things we must do ourselves.\"" ]