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What an embarrassment to this country | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing."
] |
>
He said himself that only the guilty take the fifth. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country"
] |
>
Wow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth."
] |
>
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th."
] |
>
Only the guilty plead the fifth- Trump | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something."
] |
>
Only guilty people plead the fifth. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump"
] |
>
Doesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth."
] |
>
Merrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age."
] |
>
Trump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!
AG James
How do...
Trump:
Fif! I like to show all of you a secret document!
[pulls out a piece of paper saying "FiF"]
Trump:
Fiiiiiiiiiiiiif! | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything."
] |
>
One two three four FIFFFF | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!"
] |
>
He should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF"
] |
>
Claiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not! | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too."
] |
>
I'm surprised he can count that high.... | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!"
] |
>
Gotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first! | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high...."
] |
>
Only liars take the fifth - drumpf | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!"
] |
>
Can we lock him up now? | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf"
] |
>
This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)
Newly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.
"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool," Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, "I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution."
After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.
Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5 | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?"
] |
>
Clown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5"
] |
>
why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him."
] |
>
Trump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”"
] |
>
I plead the fiz-ith
-Tron Carter | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?"
] |
>
Headline: trump says the f-word repeatedly. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter"
] |
>
I didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly."
] |
>
I'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the "deep state" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what. | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal"
] |
> | [
"“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what.",
">\n\n“If you are innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” - Former POTUS Donald J Trump, 2016.",
">\n\nThere needs to be a cut of each one of his fifths with him then saying this each time.",
">\n\nThere was actually an entire subreddit for it. It dropped in activity since he was no longer President",
">\n\nUnfortunately not active anymore",
">\n\n/r/ThanksObama",
">\n\nWhatever one might say about his presidency, Obama was always a gentleman. Remember when he read those tweets from people. Good sport.",
">\n\nAnd things weren't great but they were damn sure better. And a black president means other kids can see what is possible and society as a whole is better for it.",
">\n\nYes, regardless of his effectiveness, it was a good thing for that reason. He is a good man although I thought some of his actions were naive. Although I’ve never been potus so I shouldn’t criticize.",
">\n\nAll the Times Trump Bashed the Fifth Amendment",
">\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation. The only other people over heard talk like that IRL were employers who had no fucking clue how to run their business but always knew who to blame.",
">\n\n\nGod, it hurts me so much to hear him talk and remember that this clown lead our nation.\n\nGood. Keep that energy up. \nEvery single clown in this country who still supports this absolute buffoon needs to feel that energy too.\nMy coworkers and other people at work, I let em know what I think. I don't back down anymore. \nIt gets harder and harder for them to believe the election was stolen and people really didn't support Biden like we did. But we fucking did. We just don't go screaming about being \"Bideners\" like those clowns.",
">\n\nProblem is those clowns live that energy anything that bothers their perceived enemies is good even if it actively harms them…",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth \n~Donald J Trump",
">\n\nr/conservative is too busy reveling in legislating trans people's bodies in Utah and complaining about removing a slave owner's name from a university \nThey're obviously just busy with bigger issues \n(heaviest of sarcasm)",
">\n\ndont forget about hunter bidens dick pics!",
">\n\nAnd gas stoves",
">\n\nAnd fat, un-sexy M&M's.",
">\n\nDon't forget litter boxes in schools for kids who identify as cats.",
">\n\nBoy did that story fall off a cliff post-election or what? Reminds me of the caravans that always seem to roll around every August and September of an election year.",
">\n\nMy aunt emigrated to America like 50 years ago. She recently came back over to Scotland for a visit and was echoing the fox news qanon nonsense. Crying about feeling unsafe cause of the caravan of immigrants at the border. Reminding her she is an immigrant who got her citizenship through marriage just as she was about to be kicked out meant nothing to her. She also lives in New Jersey, not exactly close to the border.",
">\n\nMy family of Lebanese civil war refugees all voted for the guy who wanted to ban Syrian war refugees. Their literal neighbors. The brain worms conservatives catch are astounding.",
">\n\nDoes he put a Hot Pockets sleeve over his eyes when he gets the spray tan applied?",
">\n\nIt was revealed he doesn’t spray tan. He manually applies (or has someone apply) bronzer cream. Or at least that’s part of it. It’s likely he doesn’t like fingers near his eyes.",
">\n\nMichael Cohen said in interview that TFG does his own hair and makeup.",
">\n\nNo wonder it looks so shitty. That explains a lot.",
">\n\nIt's all he ever knew.",
">\n\nNo freaking way. There's no way you didn't just take a picture of Donald Trump and make the hair bigger.",
">\n\nIt's like a bad parody of The Klumps but Trump plays every family member.",
">\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings? Nope. That was Donald Trump, Hilary answered questions for 11 hours because she’s not a criminal traitor.",
">\n\n\nRemember when Hillary Clinton took the fifth amendment 400 times during the Benghazi hearings?\n\nDid you listen to Trump's little speech at the beginning when he said the proceedings were so unfair because candidate Letitia James said she would investigate Trump if she were elected and that's why he took the Fifth hundreds of times?\nOnce again hypocrisy shows no bounds with Trump. The biggest promise he made on his 2016 campaign trial was not only to investigate Hillary but throw her in jail. Somehow he didn't think that was unfair. \nTrump should learn what's good for the goose is good for the gander.",
">\n\nMy gf and I have been spending our evenings lately getting baked and watching South Park. I haven't watched this since I was probably 14. As we get deeper into later seasons it's shocking to me how Trump and Cartman are basically the same person.",
">\n\nCartman is manipulative and somewhat intelligent. Trump is just... proof that you do not need 2 brain cells to rub together to remain rich",
">\n\nWhen people started calling him bunker boy, he started show his face and being outside more and people stopped calling him that right away.He is playing this game. He keeps getting away with really crazy shit other wouldn't. I don't think he's \"smart\" by any means, but he definitely has been on fire for the past 30+ years and still going.",
">\n\nThe fact that he has gotten away with anything is more damning of the justice system than it is evidence of any skill on his part. Its like someone letting a sloth chase them down and eat them.",
">\n\nMaybe, but as he said he could shoot someone in broad daylight and not lose a voter (unless he shoots a voter) what I mean is that anyone else that says that would most certainly get in trouble, him? He just keeps falling upwards. \nThere’s a reason why. Not that I know what it is.",
">\n\nIt’s my understanding that taking the fifth with regards to the upcoming civil procedings can be rather costly. Ain’t that just too bad.",
">\n\nTaking the 5th in civil cases can be considered admission of guilt by the jury. \nThis is NOT the case in criminal proceedings, but taking the 5th in criminal doesn't look good to a jury either.",
">\n\nIn criminal cases, the judge typically instructs the jury they can't hold taking the fifth against the defendant. That isn't the case for civil suits.",
">\n\nSure, but the judge instructing the jury to not take into account things they have seen and heard is pretty close to worthless.",
">\n\nI don't know if you have served on a jury, but many take those instructions seriously. While it maybe could influence you internally, you can't use it in your rationale to other jurors, which is where the problem lies.",
">\n\nI have served on a jury. The jurors can absolutely claim to take those instructions seriously. That doesn't mean that they are actually able to do so - human nature pretty much means that they can't.\nThere have been studies done on this. They generally conclude that people can't disregard information even if they want to, sometimes attempting to do so will push them farther the other way, and sometimes being told not to consider something makes it a much bigger deal than if it wasn't mentioned.",
">\n\nNot being forced to bear witness against oneself is a great feature of the US Constitution.\nVery publicly saying that only the guilty plead the 5th, then pleading the 5th yourself, stinks like fermented garbage water.",
">\n\nConsidering he sometimes smells like soiled diaper, no one will notice.",
">\n\nSometimes?",
">\n\nThose being the times after his assistant has changed and cleaned him, before he's rage-shit himself again.",
">\n\nThat's hilarious, but is there actually a legit source for this?",
">\n\n“The mob takes the Fifth Amendment,” Donald Trump said in 2016. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\nAnd what about 'lock'er up' Hillary who spend grueling hours in front of Congress answering EVERY DAMN question?\nI don't even have to type anymore about his being a pos, as these things are self evident so so so much except to ~30-35% of this country that are members of a damn cult.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-The Gang Pleads the Fifth-",
">\n\nThat would be a 10/10 cold open",
">\n\n\nOnce the preliminary questions wrapped up, Trump was given an opportunity to read a prepared statement into the record.\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \nJust over a month later, on Sept. 21, James announced her office's lawsuit against Trump, three of his children and his company, accusing them of a long-running scheme to inflate the value of their properties. The Trumps have denied wrongdoing.\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution. \n\"This will be my answer to any further questions.\"\nSenior enforcement counsel Kevin Wallace, of the attorney general's office, noted \"for the record\" that the statement was \"lengthy,\" and that \"obviously, we disagree with a lot of the characterizations.\" Wallace then began his questioning, which would comprise the bulk of the deposition.\nAt the outset, Trump responded to three questions by saying, \"For all of the reasons provided in my answer, which is incorporated herein in its entirety, I decline to answer the question.\" \nWallace then told Trump he could just say, \"same answer\" — \"to speed things up.\" \nTrump did so more than 400 times during the course of the full interview, according to sources. After the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\nDuring one section of questioning, Wallace asked Trump about his Statements of Financial Condition, submitted every year since 2011. In February 2022, the accounting firm that prepared them recanted its work and said those reports \"should no longer be relied upon.\"\n\"The valuations contained in this document reflect false and misleading valuation statements; is that correct?\" Wallace asked. \n\"Same answer,\" Trump replied.\nWas he \"aware\" they \"contained false and misleading statements\"?\n\"Same answer.\"",
">\n\n\n\"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\n\nI wonder how long he had to practice that sentence, to not fuck it up.",
">\n\nIn civil proceedings, taking the fifth may be interpreted as an admission of guilt.",
">\n\nAdverse inference is the legal term",
">\n\nFascists are always cowards. They don't project strength, they hide behind it. They don't have ideas, they spread fear and panic about other people's ideas. They have no purpose to their power except to accumulate more of it.",
">\n\nFacts.",
">\n\nThe majority of NYers did not vote for Donald Trump because we knew all too well his history of being a conman, a fraud and a liar.\nWhat we didn't know was how gullible and easily conned a good portion of our nation is. There are a fuckton of fools easily parted with their cash out there. And apparently Trump was well aware of that fact.",
">\n\nNo but you don’t understand magical beings from heaven and Jesus are going to come down and JFK Junior will be VP and Donald will be president for life",
">\n\nIf that ever happens, I am all for chilling out with Satan on that cold day in hell",
">\n\nMaking threats about litigation just to fold and finally loses case. Tough guy turns out to be a whiner.",
">\n\nThis mf loathes the law so much, he would sue the DOJ for obstructing his criminal enterprise if he could. Zero morality garbage",
">\n\nDidn't he essentially do that when they were trying to get all the classified docs back from Mar a Lago?",
">\n\nHe and his entire family need to take the L and fuck off.",
">\n\nTrump: \"I will drain the swamp\"\nTrump is easily part of the swamp if not the worst part\nTrump: \"Anyone that invokes the fifth amendment is a criminal\"\nTrump invoked the 5th\nTrump: \"Anyone that mishandled classified documents should be in prison\"\nTrump mishandled classified documents (and worse than anyone caught before or after him)\n\"If I lose its because it's rigged\"\nTrump tried to rig the election by installing fake electors and his little maga wacko-insurrectionist-cult members attempted to subvert the peaceful and democratic transfer of power, with an overwhelming concensus that Trump incited it\nI think I'm sensing a pattern here...",
">\n\nEvery accusation is a confession.",
">\n\nHe is such a scum. He must be held accountable for the first time in his life probably. He needs to be made an example of.",
">\n\nAbsolutely. This needs to happen. He really needs to show he's not untouchable and needs to do hard time in prison.",
">\n\nAnd in a civil proceeding invoking the fifth CAN be seen as an admission of guilt. He’s either dumber then we thought, or has the most incompetent lawyers. I tend to think both apply.",
">\n\nI'm pretty sure his lawyers weighed the consequences of letting him talk vs what he did. \nThis guy would not only fail to provide any useful context on his actions in his defense, he would create entirely new legal problems he didn't already have, if he talked. \nThey honestly did a great job convincing him not to talk. We've seen his previous depositions where he did. It was bad.",
">\n\njust wanted to say thanks for posting your own articles, genuinely appreciate it",
">\n\nHe’s so dirty in so many areas the Fifth is the only answer he CAN give. Disgusting loser.",
">\n\nLock him up. Lock him up. Lock him up.",
">\n\nI'm just surprised he didn't work Hunter Biden into every response.",
">\n\n\nin the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation\n\ncivil cases the jury can use peoples responses of 'the 5th' against them. So... that isn't good for Trump.",
">\n\nThe only people still supporting this guy are people who are just like him",
">\n\nTwo things can be mutually true:\n\n\nThe 5th Amendment is your Constitutional right \n\n\nSaid individual has repeatedly bashed people who take said right to claim \"that means they are guilty\".\n\n\nVery clearly another case of hypocrisy that drives normal people crazy",
">\n\nExcept this is a civil case and pleading the 5th is equivalent to I’m guilty.",
">\n\nI still can’t understand how the intellectual water level is so low that half the country convinced themselves this guy isn’t the dumbest motherfucker to shit behind two shoes.",
">\n\nIf they have him on record saying \"you're guilty if you invoke the 5th\".. Can't they just take his 400 pleads of the 5th as admission of guilt?",
">\n\nWas anyone really expecting anything different?",
">\n\nI never expect him to say anything useful.",
">\n\nsoooo badly after all that I want the next question to be \n“Mr Trump, have you yourself said publicly dozens of times that only guilty people plead the fifth?”\n“same answer”",
">\n\nGuilty, guilty, guilty!",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\n\nIf you are not guilty of a crime, what do you need immunity for?\n The mob takes the Fifth Amendment. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment? \n-- Donald, I commit 15 crimes before breakfast, Trump",
">\n\nI have always wondered if the people who voted for him truly understand what a con man he is.",
">\n\nNope, because they are still backing him lol.",
">\n\nThat's not very alpha male of him.",
">\n\nIt was a perfect 5th.",
">\n\n\"only the mob takes the fifth.\"",
">\n\n“You see the mob takes the fifth\" - “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -Donald J Trump, Iowa rally, 2016.",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”\n-Don “Bunker Grandpa” Trunk",
">\n\nDon’t only criminals take the 5th? I heard that somewhere",
">\n\nHe looks like a punished toddler.\nIt's not fair. I didn't do it. Your mean to me.",
">\n\nWhen his opponents plead the fifth it's because they have something to hide.\nWhen he does it its because it's political persecution.\nWhat a fucken hypocrite...",
">\n\nNot a large leap to the \"if You are innocent, you don't need to run from the police\"...\nAnybody having Trump running from the police on their 2023 bingo card?",
">\n\nHey donnie... thought only guilty people plead the 5th???? hypocritical orange turd",
">\n\nWhat an absolute pos",
">\n\nThe perfect campaign ad is the start where he says only guilty people plead the fifth, then for a solid minute it's him being asked questions and he repeat \"same answer\" from the first fifth take, and then it ends with \"and you think this man should run for president?“\nAnd that's the only ad you need against him in 2024.",
">\n\nWow not only the 45th but the 440 5th!",
">\n\nHuh. And here I thought only crooks pleaded the Fifth.",
">\n\nDear DJT,\nF*** your feelings!\nSincerely,\nA liberal.",
">\n\nBut you said only cowards plead the fifth?",
">\n\nDonald Trump declaring himself guilty af",
">\n\nWeakness personified.",
">\n\nWhat was it that he said about those who plead the 5th amendment ?",
">\n\nYeah, but not him dude … it’s different when he does it. /s",
">\n\n\"The only moral Taking The Fifth is my Taking The Fifth!\"",
">\n\nThis was civil not criminal. So, if civil, I thought pleading the 5th can be used against you. \"Adverse inferences\" are allowed if someone is pleading the 5th. \nEffectively, since civil cases are simply a 'more likely than not' threshold, you can effectively view pleading the 5th as suspicious as hell and use that to weigh towards 'more likely than not'.\n(Need a real lawyer to weigh in and tell me how right/wrong my stupid non-lawyer ass is)",
">\n\n\nHe began with a familiar refrain: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country.\" He called James \"a renegade and out of control prosecutor\" and accused her of having political motives for her office's investigation into his financial practices. \n\nIt's always so delicious when they use that defense because you know they literally have nothing else.",
">\n\nThe menace in his face and his dead eyes is revolting. Trump is textbook “end-stage psychopathy.” Anti-social personality disorder (psychopathy, sociopathy, etc) gets worse as people who have the disorder get older. Trump needs to be removed from society.",
">\n\nSeize all trump family assets via civil forfeiture. Or do rich people get treated differently in the US?",
">\n\nCrazy to think that an ex-president admitting, over 400 times, that his answers to questions under oath would incriminate him isn't a blockbuster news story, it's just Monday.",
">\n\n\"So, there are five people taking the Fifth Amendment. Like you see on the mob, right? You see the mob takes the Fifth. If you're innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?\" he asked at the time.\"",
">\n\n“If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?” -DJT",
">\n\nRemember, in civil cases, refusing to answer the questions can be construed as guilt. This isn't criminal, so pleading the 5th just makes him look like hes hiding something. So this deposition is a gold mine for the state of new york.",
">\n\nMan I can't wait for the presidential campaigning to kick off. Trump doesn't seem like the type to not run and I dont see him getting locked up before then. It's going to be wild when he finally realized that the days where he could shoot someone in times square and get away with it are over. Call me a deviant if you want but sometimes there's nothing better than seeing the look on someone's face when they realize they've lost everything because they just weren't smart enough to walk away sooner",
">\n\nDamn that must have been so fucking boring for both parties lol. They knew nothing would be answered but still went through it all.",
">\n\nthere needs to be some threshold of how much of your life you can reasonably \"not recall\" before you're unable to hold public office due or outright ruled incompetent... either you can remember and testify to events or you can't and have no business presiding over said events.",
">\n\nWake me up when he’s charged with a crime. Eric Garner was choked out by NYC cops and died for selling loose cigarettes, with no day in court, yet this asshole has spent half his miserable existence on this planet hiding behind his lawyers and the courts.",
">\n\n\"Only criminals take the 5th\" Trumps very own words...",
">\n\nWhat a f:/$ loser. A pathetic human disgrace. Waste of any sperm. The definition of satanic belief and symbolism.",
">\n\nAnd is cult is undeterred,",
">\n\nFor all the s*** he talks, he sure snowflaked up. Like his snowflake followers.",
">\n\nOh man, when are we gonna be done with this guy?? I’m so tired of hearing his name, hearing him speak, seeing his face!",
">\n\n“Donnie, if you’re so perfect and innocent, why pleading the fifth repeatedly, “ Hillary asked?",
">\n\nThey shouldn't let him get away with \"same answer.\" He should have to say it. \"I plead my fifth amendment right against self incrimination.\"",
">\n\n“Innocent people don’t plead the 5th” is a famous quote from… drum roll… Trump!",
">\n\nLet me put this as eloquently as I can, fuck this guy",
">\n\nEffing chicken 💩",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is the worst thing\nPleading the fifth is the best thing\nthe hypocrisy is the point. Being a brazen hypocrite is what makes fascists nut",
">\n\nBut i thought only wiseguys and guilty peolle to the fifth? Just another lie from our former President. Traitor Trump.",
">\n\nTrump is a cow.",
">\n\nLock him up!",
">\n\nI am honestly surprised that a judge found Trump mentally competent enough to give sworn testimony.",
">\n\nFrom the article:\n\n\"This whole thing is very unfair,\" Trump says in the deposition video.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a great fool. I’m not a great fool, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of you. But you must have known I was not a great fool; you would have counted on it, so I can clearly not answer the question in front of me!\n\nNow where have I heard this monologue before…",
">\n\nDuring a deposition in a civil suit, by claiming the 5th Amendment you are subject to what’s called “adverse inference,” which means the prosecution’s case gets better every time you do.\nThe twice-impeached ex-president “plead the fifth,” over 400 times.\nAny and all instances of him pleading the fifth will now be used against him in the civil suit.",
">\n\nOnly criminals plea the fifth - Drump...",
">\n\nNope! I do it believe it. Trump hates the 5th , he said it is there for guilty people.",
">\n\nHe is as slimy as the come, how in the hell he ever was American President,makes me sick. He woke the underbelly of this country, An absolute concern for our future. Please shut him up, every time he opens up his mouth,he looks crazier.",
">\n\nPlease rise if you are able and join in singing Trump's National Anthem.\nOh, say can you Fifth, by the dawn's early Fifth\nWhat so proudly we Fifth, at the twilight's Fifth Fifth Fifth\nWhose broad Fifths and bright Fifths, through the perilous Fifth\nO'er the Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, were so Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nFifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth, Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nGave Fifth Fifth Fifth night, that our Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth\nO, say does that Fifth Fifth Fifth Fifth Fi-i-i-ifth Fi-ifth\nO'er the land of the Fifth, and the Fifth of the brave",
">\n\nTrump did say only the guilty take the fifth before he took.the fifth himself.\nTrump double standard",
">\n\nAnyone have a link to the video thats not on their site?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nOnly CRIMINALS plead the 5th, right Donny? We heard it from the jackass’s mouth!",
">\n\nTraitor coward.",
">\n\nIt also shows the saying is true: we all create our own hell. Here’s a withered tired old man who is caught in a trap he’s made for himself. Abusing the system and courts his entire life and thinking himself a pro, now he will do this repeatedly until the day he dies.\nKarma will get you. Sooner or later, you’ll pay one way or another.",
">\n\nHe's a stain.",
">\n\nHe’s incapable of telling the truth",
">\n\nI guess he thinks that if he doesn't tell them anything that the problem will just go away. What a dumbass.",
">\n\nI would think it’d make a fun campaign video for someone - him saying only the mob take the fifth amendment followed by him taking it 400 times…..",
">\n\nOnly the mob pleads the fifth...",
">\n\nI am dreaming of a world without Trump’s face, voice, tweets, quotes, 💩plastered all over mass media and social media…\nIs it too much to ask??? When? When will he go away??!",
">\n\nI can't wait to hear him say that he never said that only guilty people take the 5th.\nI guarantee you that he will say that only smart people do it, because he's insane and his supporters will cheer.",
">\n\nPerhaps he meant \"drink\" a fifth...",
">\n\nWhat a douche.",
">\n\nTrump: Only guilty people plead the fifth!\nAlso Trump: it's fine for me, though",
">\n\nA good video compilation of him saying “Only guilty people plead the fifth” and him pleading the fifth should be playing on EVERY media platform in the fucking galaxy.",
">\n\nPleading the fifth is all he ever does when he's not treating his depositions like a rally, ranting about the 2020 election, Biden, etc.\nSeriously, the only recent deposition info I've seen regarding Trump where he wasn't pleading the fifth was in the E. Jean Carroll case. There he was just spouting off all the same old BS he tells his supporters in his safe space rallies, as well as threatening to sue everyone in the room.\nDude's not doing too well.",
">\n\nDidn't he say only criminals plead the fifth?",
">\n\nI've never heard so many quotes in one statement:\n\nI have an article here that says quote Michael Cohen is a quote loser and a quote liar...\n\nI don't think he quite understands the concept of quoting.",
">\n\nHe always criticizes others non-stop. UNLESS it's him doing the same thing for his own advantage, then he says he's a genius.\nWhat a complete moron.\nI mean, he was president and up to that point in his deposition last year he didn't have a clue what the 5th amendment was for??",
">\n\nSame person who as a candidate said only someone with something to hide uses the fifth amendment, Then he finally got to a point where the courts had enough of his using lawyers and countersuits to delay testimony or deposition. He changed his toon rather quickly.",
">\n\nIs it the light on my phone or is he growing a Hitler moustache?",
">\n\n\"If you are innocent, do not remain silent. You look guilty as hell!\"\n-Donald Trump",
">\n\nDidn’t someone count how many times he took the 5th? Wasn’t it like 455 times?",
">\n\n1,2,3,4,5 i remember that Dave Chappell skit",
">\n\nCommitting tax fraud and pleading the faith proves that I’m smart. People are saying the best business people plead the 5th.",
">\n\nDid anyone expect anything else??? And of course the 5th is keeping quite to not implicate self. Ironically Hillary testified for 11hrs and never once pleaded 5th.",
">\n\n1-2-3-4-fif",
">\n\nI'll watch an advertisement to see him being handcuffed fingerprinted and booked. I'm not wasting a second watching this prick.",
">\n\nFucking weasely coward. I hope he shits his pants on the stand.",
">\n\nI don't mean this to be a controversial or rhetorical question, but does pointing to hypocrisy ever work with conservative/republican/authoritian types or does it just briefly silence them until they've found a new thing to point to thats supports their view?",
">\n\nFuck Trump but let's not make a mockery of the 5th amendment, it's everyone's right to use and it and should be so there's no need to shame it's use because that's how public opinion gets moved over time and then 15 years from now it's gone. I'm aware that that he's blasted it's use before, but it's a good thing to have and use.",
">\n\nI'm still surprised America didn't burn in an inferno considering an ape was their head of state for 4 years.",
">\n\nOnly bums plead the 5th.... or was it criminals?",
">\n\nMy man looks like he's got a 5 o clock shadow with that botched makeup tan",
">\n\nIsn’t there video out there if him saying anyone who takes the fifth is obviously guilty?",
">\n\nSeems like the only way to shut him up is to depose him.",
">\n\nThe lack of joy in his face is wonderful",
">\n\nHis hair looks like half eaten banana flavored cotton candy.",
">\n\nI would like to see a video of him saying \"people that plead the fifth are guilty.\" And all that shit he said, mixed in between clips of him pleading the fifth.",
">\n\nWeak man for even weaker men.",
">\n\n\"Only guilty people take the 5th\" Donald J Trump",
">\n\nAG: \"Anything you say in this examination may be used in a civil proceeding, do you understand that?\"\nTrump: \"I think?\"\nAG: \"Is that a yes\nTrump: \"I don't know what I did wrong, but I understand, yes\"\nAG: \"This investigation is confidential, we request that you not discuss this matter, your testimony today and any documents you have produced or may produce with anyone other than your attorneys. Do you understand that sir?\"\nTrump: \"No, when you say confidential, we are not allowed to talk about this to the press?\"\nAG: \"Correct.\"\nHe cant even make it through the first question without the AG asking to go off the record.\nAG: \" What have you done today to prepare for this meeting?\"\nTrump: \"Very little.\"\n*Trump's attorney advises he read the statement prepared, which he refuses to do.\nAG suggests we go off the record.\nTrump then begins to read his statement:\nTrump: \"This is the greatest witch hunt in the history of our country. There has been another president and perhaps another politician who has been persecuted, harassed and in every other way unfairly treated, like President Donald J. Trump. What Leticia James has tried to do the last number of years is a disgrace to the legal system and a front to the NY State tax payers, and a violation of the solemn rights of the US Constitution. She developed a political platform and made a career out of maliciously attacking me and my business before she even understood or was elected or reviewed one of the millions of pages of documents we willing produced. We willingly produced these documents. She announced that she quote 'was obsessed with taking me on', taking me on folks..... This whole thing is very unfair.\" He then goes into talking about Michael Cohen being a \"total loser.\"\nWhat a fucking wanker man, this is the former president of the free world acting like an petulant child. I will enjoy watching him squirm in more depositions like this, Leticia James plus the Georgia election need to never let up on this disgrace. May god do the world a favor and deliver the justice and accountability this man has managed to avoid for his entire lifetime.\n\nEdit:\n\nHe also brings up how he did once reference those who bring up the 5th are part of the mafia, and now he understands why someone would do that, and anyone in his position would be an absolute fool to not take the 5th. Because of course, this asshole cant stand by anything other than self serving options.\n\nTrump pleaded the 5th more than 400 times during this deposition and did not answer 1, not a single question. He's a loser and a coward.",
">\n\nAnyone who uses the 5th amendment should just be charged, because they are clearly lying.",
">\n\nI think at this point they can get away with calling him “disgraced former president”",
">\n\nthis fuck has got to go. at this point, i'd settle for him just dying of natural causes",
">\n\nhm no post about this on r/conservative wonder why",
">\n\nGarbage human",
">\n\nOne of the biggest assholes and golf cheaters of the 20th and 21st century.",
">\n\nIt’s all fun and games until you jump into the ring",
">\n\nThe most successful conman in the HISTORY of the human race.",
">\n\nVideo of a traitor…\nFIFY\nTraitor needs to be attached anytime that piece of shits name is said.",
">\n\nThis guy is like the most buoyant turd I’ve ever tried to flush. I am literally the person he was talking, flushing the toilet five or six times, knowing with each flush that the nasty mother fucker was going to slime its way back and rise to the top of the bowl, like a proud shit-orca whale. I lift the seat, some days the turd isn’t there, but I’m sure I hear it still, rumbling in the plumbing.",
">\n\nWhat an embarrassment to this country",
">\n\nHe said himself that only the guilty take the fifth.",
">\n\nWow..in his own words only criminals plead the 5th.",
">\n\nI’ve said it before and I’ll say it again. When someone acts like they have something to hide, it’s usually because they’re hiding something.",
">\n\nOnly the guilty plead the fifth- Trump",
">\n\nOnly guilty people plead the fifth.",
">\n\nDoesn't matter. Nothing will ever happen to him. He'll just continue to evade and dodge until he dies of old age.",
">\n\nMerrick the Meek and Mild certainly is not going to do anything.",
">\n\nTrump: There are! I say there are so many amendments in the constitution of the United States of Americaaaa! I can only choose one! I can only choose ooooooone! I plead the fif! I plead the fif! FIVE! 1,2,3,4, fiiiif! Anything you say! FIIIF! Go ahead and ask me a question!\nAG James\nHow do...\nTrump:\nFif! I like to show all of you a secret document!\n[pulls out a piece of paper saying \"FiF\"]\nTrump:\nFiiiiiiiiiiiiif!",
">\n\nOne two three four FIFFFF",
">\n\nHe should t be allowed to say “same” or “fifth”. Instead he should be forced to go through the whole “Upon advice of counsel…”. Make it a pain in the ass for him too.",
">\n\nClaiming the fifth by anyone is an admission of guilt. Trump even said that himself. Now do any of you Trump Republicans want to argue with me on that one? I think not!",
">\n\nI'm surprised he can count that high....",
">\n\nGotta plead the fifth, cuz you can't plead the first!",
">\n\nOnly liars take the fifth - drumpf",
">\n\nCan we lock him up now?",
">\n\nThis is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 90%. (I'm a bot)\n\n\nNewly released video obtained by CBS News provides the first look at former President Donald Trump's deposition last summer in the New York attorney general's civil fraud investigation.\n\"Anyone in my position not taking the Fifth Amendment would be a fool, an absolute fool,\" Trump said, adding that on the advice of counsel, \"I respectfully decline to answer the questions under the rights and privileges afforded to every citizen under the United States Constitution.\"\nAfter the deposition concluded, Trump issued a public statement saying that he had exercised his Fifth Amendment right and refused to answer.\n\n\nExtended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Trump^#1 question^#2 New^#3 attorney^#4 answer^#5",
">\n\nClown, just like all of the people who ever voted for him.",
">\n\nwhy are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”",
">\n\nTrump has suggested on many occasions that people who invoke their right against self-incrimination are guilty. “You see the mob takes the Fifth,” Trump said during a 2016 rally in Iowa. “If you’re innocent, why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?",
">\n\nI plead the fiz-ith\n-Tron Carter",
">\n\nHeadline: trump says the f-word repeatedly.",
">\n\nI didn’t realize you could take the 5th in civil proceedings, as they are by nature not criminal",
">\n\nI'm sure his worshipers will praise him for this, denying the \"deep state\" an chance to attack for Donald unfairly. The fact is he's a fucking crook who doesn't have the strength of his convictions to put his money where his mouth is. But hey, he's a bully to every one of the right's culture war boogeymen so they love him no matter what."
] |
At least you have an excuse.
I actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway. | [] |
>
Bubble75 Sky blue
GMK 80085 blue
L+F gateron ink blacks
Durock v2 stabs | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway."
] |
>
I just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys. | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs"
] |
>
Great board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys."
] |
>
I actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol! | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps"
] |
>
When you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!"
] |
>
Nice photo regardless! | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB"
] |
>
That metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!"
] |
>
We've all been there | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD"
] |
>
" This is The Way".... | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD",
">\n\nWe've all been there"
] |
>
Can this plastic lid be opened? | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD",
">\n\nWe've all been there",
">\n\n\" This is The Way\"...."
] |
>
Smart 😉 | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD",
">\n\nWe've all been there",
">\n\n\" This is The Way\"....",
">\n\nCan this plastic lid be opened?"
] |
>
As it should be 🙂 | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD",
">\n\nWe've all been there",
">\n\n\" This is The Way\"....",
">\n\nCan this plastic lid be opened?",
">\n\nSmart 😉"
] |
>
I hate rgb but this looks pleasant. | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD",
">\n\nWe've all been there",
">\n\n\" This is The Way\"....",
">\n\nCan this plastic lid be opened?",
">\n\nSmart 😉",
">\n\nAs it should be 🙂"
] |
> | [
"At least you have an excuse.\nI actually own several really nice cameras, and can never get motivated enough to actually pull one out, so I shoot crappy pics on my phone anyway.",
">\n\nBubble75 Sky blue\nGMK 80085 blue\nL+F gateron ink blacks \nDurock v2 stabs",
">\n\nI just built a sky blue Bubble75 as well. I used Gazzew Boba LT switches and clones of gmk nautilus. You get rid of the rgb by pressing Fn and right alt. You can change rgb by pressing Fn and spacebar and then the intensity of the rgb by pressing Fn and the up and down arrow keys.",
">\n\nGreat board, but i don’t like rgb on expensive keycaps",
">\n\nI actually don’t know how to turn it off yet lol!",
">\n\nWhen you figure it out, post another pic. I'd like to see what it looks like without the RGB",
">\n\nNice photo regardless!",
">\n\nThat metal keycap on the right is probably more expensive than my entire keyboard xD",
">\n\nWe've all been there",
">\n\n\" This is The Way\"....",
">\n\nCan this plastic lid be opened?",
">\n\nSmart 😉",
">\n\nAs it should be 🙂",
">\n\nI hate rgb but this looks pleasant."
] |
The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith.
Nothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday. | [] |
>
True, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.
The missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.
(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic) | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday."
] |
>
I'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok.
Put this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it?
You fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.
Going abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people.
So why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible?
The answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)"
] |
>
Just because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.
It seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?
This feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday."
] |
>
And if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.
Actually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.
I don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.
The same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are "the chosen people" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work."
] |
>
Let me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.
A person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.
My point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people.
So while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife."
] |
>
I think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved.
I would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18).
Respect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is."
] |
>
Going and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same.
But
There are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it."
] |
>
You can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.
There is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google.
If you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better.
And at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community? | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts."
] |
>
Mission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.
Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?
If this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.
I am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person) | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?"
] |
>
I am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)
But without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?
It's like saying, "it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable"
Sure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what?
As an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go "too far", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)"
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There's a few things that make missionaries unliked.
Privacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.
Belief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no.
Also, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false? | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child."
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I'm Jewish.
Our history is filled with "well-meaning" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.
Not just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.
Beliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.
And, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.
Further, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.
The destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this.
When operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful." | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?"
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This is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute "Christians" for "Nazis" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.
People that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\""
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If we were to substitute "Christians" for "Nazis" I doubt we'd feel the same
Sure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents.
Also, a "church" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all."
] |
>
Sure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.
Which is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.
A Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls
Sure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.
I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents.
I can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion."
] |
>
We are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho.
The type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their "sin" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread."
] |
>
I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their "sin" in place of their God taking over by that point.
But to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.
Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.
Many don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders."
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But to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book
Ok, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho.
I have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, "sinners" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.
Good discussion tho tbh, respect | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality."
] |
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Ah, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.
If I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect"
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I've never met a single Christian who believes that. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that."
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Missionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.
No amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that."
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This is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.
I'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty."
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Yeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization."
] |
>
Maybe add "respectful" to my definition then, along with sincere. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away."
] |
>
And to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere."
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Our disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions."
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In your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve "blind hatred". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?
Can you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way? | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye."
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I see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.
The second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?"
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a personal effort to save an individuals soul.
Can you give some real life examples of what this would be?
hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society
This is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives."
] |
>
I have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the "good word" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one.
He is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.
This is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.
And, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the "Reddit demographic" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous."
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So according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.
So what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.
Now they are doomed to hell.
Seems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary."
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A mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.
I can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.
People can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited."
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an annoyance
Well I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others.
People can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?
Absolutely not! | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example."
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Their love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.
They destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.
Spreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.
They spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!"
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impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.
All of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.
People shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general."
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is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to.
Then what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be "saved" from so they don't end up in hell.
The bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.
It's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.
If they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others."
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More Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.
South Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly.
Missionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing?
If you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to.
And if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there.
Faith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful."
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Mission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post.
I'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a "hit it n quit it" route. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse."
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Ok, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.
If there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion.
But like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.
And I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to "endlessly rip on religion." Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?
I think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.
Can you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?
But yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people.
Good intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route."
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I am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It"
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Let me come at it this way.
If a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.
Why? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way.
If I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another.
If Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me.
A missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency.
The missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)
A person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread."
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If a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.
Exactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.
The Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers."
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I think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is "the ugly thing" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the "no true Scotsman" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.
The second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity.
It's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play."
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idk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves."
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Why does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their "good word". | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral"
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The truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\"."
] |
>
Well... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this "dead at work" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here.
He doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or "sin" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.
This is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.
I don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price"
] |
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Do you believe your friends is an exception or the standard? | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it."
] |
>
Tough question. Missionary work is not always "visit a place and spread the word". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved.
I will however claim "exception" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term "church" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?"
] |
>
People, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.
People like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.
The point is that they aren't recieving "too much blind hatred": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word."
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And certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain
See, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?
I'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a "political" element. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets."
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So from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person.
But being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done.
In other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off.
However moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm.
Spreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element."
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Inherently, the "mission" of a missionary is to try to sway people to their belief system. Even if this is done innocently, and with good intention.
There are incredibly respectful missionaries for Jehovah's Witnesses at the train station that I go through every day. Meeting your weirdly narrow standard, they are respectful, and likely really do genuinely intend to spread goodness and help others. But they are also selling the message of a rather controversial group that has substantially sketchy things on the resume, and reject medicine as well as free speech.
These people are, by your standard, trying to save you from pain in their eyes. But their message is such that if it works, they could be leading someone down a pretty dark path.
And by the way, Thanos had missionaries too. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element.",
">\n\nSo from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person. \nBut being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done. \nIn other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off. \nHowever moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm. \nSpreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is."
] |
>
(without instruction from & affiliation with a church)
I haven't read all the comments yet to see if anyone else asked about this, but is this a thing?
So you wouldn't be counting the Mormon (etc.) missionaries? | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element.",
">\n\nSo from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person. \nBut being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done. \nIn other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off. \nHowever moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm. \nSpreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is.",
">\n\nInherently, the \"mission\" of a missionary is to try to sway people to their belief system. Even if this is done innocently, and with good intention.\nThere are incredibly respectful missionaries for Jehovah's Witnesses at the train station that I go through every day. Meeting your weirdly narrow standard, they are respectful, and likely really do genuinely intend to spread goodness and help others. But they are also selling the message of a rather controversial group that has substantially sketchy things on the resume, and reject medicine as well as free speech.\nThese people are, by your standard, trying to save you from pain in their eyes. But their message is such that if it works, they could be leading someone down a pretty dark path.\nAnd by the way, Thanos had missionaries too."
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Whether someone “truly believes” what they are doing is good has no bearing on whether it is in fact good. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element.",
">\n\nSo from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person. \nBut being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done. \nIn other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off. \nHowever moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm. \nSpreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is.",
">\n\nInherently, the \"mission\" of a missionary is to try to sway people to their belief system. Even if this is done innocently, and with good intention.\nThere are incredibly respectful missionaries for Jehovah's Witnesses at the train station that I go through every day. Meeting your weirdly narrow standard, they are respectful, and likely really do genuinely intend to spread goodness and help others. But they are also selling the message of a rather controversial group that has substantially sketchy things on the resume, and reject medicine as well as free speech.\nThese people are, by your standard, trying to save you from pain in their eyes. But their message is such that if it works, they could be leading someone down a pretty dark path.\nAnd by the way, Thanos had missionaries too.",
">\n\n\n(without instruction from & affiliation with a church)\n\nI haven't read all the comments yet to see if anyone else asked about this, but is this a thing? \nSo you wouldn't be counting the Mormon (etc.) missionaries?"
] |
>
Just because they have fiction stories they want to spread doesn't in inherently make them good people.
They aren't doing anything real. Saving souls is meaningless. Any time saving souls is time wasted on useless efforts.
They aren't helping people. They aren't feeding people. They aren't educating people. They are just getting another notch for their spiritual belt. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element.",
">\n\nSo from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person. \nBut being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done. \nIn other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off. \nHowever moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm. \nSpreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is.",
">\n\nInherently, the \"mission\" of a missionary is to try to sway people to their belief system. Even if this is done innocently, and with good intention.\nThere are incredibly respectful missionaries for Jehovah's Witnesses at the train station that I go through every day. Meeting your weirdly narrow standard, they are respectful, and likely really do genuinely intend to spread goodness and help others. But they are also selling the message of a rather controversial group that has substantially sketchy things on the resume, and reject medicine as well as free speech.\nThese people are, by your standard, trying to save you from pain in their eyes. But their message is such that if it works, they could be leading someone down a pretty dark path.\nAnd by the way, Thanos had missionaries too.",
">\n\n\n(without instruction from & affiliation with a church)\n\nI haven't read all the comments yet to see if anyone else asked about this, but is this a thing? \nSo you wouldn't be counting the Mormon (etc.) missionaries?",
">\n\nWhether someone “truly believes” what they are doing is good has no bearing on whether it is in fact good."
] |
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The whole point of missionary work is to destroy all other cultures and religions and replace them with a dominant one. They may be convinced that this is for a good cause, but it is ultimately deeply destructive. It doesn't stop being destructive just because they've imagined a justification for the behavior. | [
"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element.",
">\n\nSo from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person. \nBut being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done. \nIn other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off. \nHowever moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm. \nSpreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is.",
">\n\nInherently, the \"mission\" of a missionary is to try to sway people to their belief system. Even if this is done innocently, and with good intention.\nThere are incredibly respectful missionaries for Jehovah's Witnesses at the train station that I go through every day. Meeting your weirdly narrow standard, they are respectful, and likely really do genuinely intend to spread goodness and help others. But they are also selling the message of a rather controversial group that has substantially sketchy things on the resume, and reject medicine as well as free speech.\nThese people are, by your standard, trying to save you from pain in their eyes. But their message is such that if it works, they could be leading someone down a pretty dark path.\nAnd by the way, Thanos had missionaries too.",
">\n\n\n(without instruction from & affiliation with a church)\n\nI haven't read all the comments yet to see if anyone else asked about this, but is this a thing? \nSo you wouldn't be counting the Mormon (etc.) missionaries?",
">\n\nWhether someone “truly believes” what they are doing is good has no bearing on whether it is in fact good.",
">\n\nJust because they have fiction stories they want to spread doesn't in inherently make them good people. \nThey aren't doing anything real. Saving souls is meaningless. Any time saving souls is time wasted on useless efforts. \nThey aren't helping people. They aren't feeding people. They aren't educating people. They are just getting another notch for their spiritual belt."
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"The issue isnt people living their faith. It's that missionary work is trying to get other people to live your faith. \nNothing wrong with that in principle, but these people are invariably not living their own faith. Also nothing wrong with that in principle, but when you combine the 2 the result is often (but not always) a self serving effort to have a religious holiday.",
">\n\nTrue, missionaries trying to get people groups to live the faith is often problematic. I do not think this is an inherent part of missionary work, but perhaps the missionaries I have met are few and far in between.\nThe missionaries I am describing and have met are focused basically only on salvation, and equipping other people (who they have a real relationship with) with tools to live what the Bible describes to be a fulfilling life. They don't see it as appropriate to judge others, because that's God's role - not humans.\n(again, I don't believe this stuff, but I understand the logic)",
">\n\nI'm not sure how focusing of salvation and getting people to live the faith are different but ok. \nPut this another way. If they want to help people (doesn't really matter how or why) that's great. The question to ask though is why are they going abroad to do it? \nYou fly out to Africa or wherever to help people, and you have driven past tons of people who need help. Your also spending a ton of money that the people in need could really use, just to get to a different place with different people.\nGoing abroad to help people (unless you have a specific in need skill set) is one of the worst ways to help people. \nSo why are these people doing the thing they are trying to do in the worst way possible? \nThe answer is gunna boil down to it being a holiday.",
">\n\nJust because their belief in their religion is sincere does not mean it is reasonable. Why should someone spreading falsehoods be admirable just because they are sincere in it and wish to help people? In the long run, sometimes falsehoods can cause grave harm; spreading falsehoods, and spreading an attitude that seeks to ignore truth and reality, seems like something which is not really beneficial.\nIt seems like it could be an analogue to someone who genuinely believes vaccines have no therapeutic value, for any disease, and tries to get everyone to stop taking all vaccines. Do you believe such a behavior is admirable? Even if it causes the death and disfigurment of thousands?\nThis feels like it may also turn into a 'no true scotsman' case; wherein numerous examples of bad missionaries are shown, and you simply state you're not talking about them; so we're just talking about a hypothetical missionary that is very rare in the real world rather than the actual typical real world behavior the disdain for missionaries is a response to. Especially when we go further back in time there's no shortage of horrible deeds done in the name of missionary work.",
">\n\n\nAnd if this person truly believes that others will experience agony in eternal isolation from God (goodness) after death unless they accept the message of the Bible, how is it a problem for them to preach it? They are literally trying to save you from horrible eternal pain, in their eyes.\n\nActually it's quite dehumanizing. According to them and their god, they believe you deserve eternal suffering. Add all the evil in the world, all the atrocities humans have committed and put it all onto you. It's that's not even a drop in an ocean of infinite pain. I don't need to respect someone who views me with such indignity simply because I don't believe.\nI don't despise Christians for this belief because I realize from religious upbringing they haven't thought through the ramifications. You love a god who will banish you to hell for the pettiest crime. What benevolent leader will torture you for just telling a single lie in your life. They have a god who is the absolute truth, and that truth is they are better than you for their beliefs. You are inferior.\nThe same way I hate racists for thinking a group of people are inferior, I hate religious folk who think they are \"the chosen people\" (that's just racism), or you deserve inhumane treatment, even if it's the afterlife.",
">\n\nLet me propose a hypothetical situation to highlight where I think your logic breaks down.\nA person sincerely and fervently believes that anyone who dies before the age of 18 will go to heaven and anyone who dies at 18 or older will go to hell. They take a trip to a foreign country and kill several children to save them from an eternity of torment if they should live past their 18th birthdays. Would you call that person's actions admirable? If not, why not? This hypothetical person's belief is just as true and sincere as a missionary's. He is truly living his life based on his beliefs. In fact you can argue he's even more noble than the missionary because missionaries in today's world are rarely harmed but this man is almost certainly facing death or life in prison for his actions.\nMy point is to emphasize that sincerely and truly believing something doesn't automatically make acting on those beliefs admirable. The actions you're taking in support of those beliefs matter. Simply believing that you're doing good doesn't automatically make it true. Now obviously a missionary's actions aren't equivalent to child murder. But they're not necessarily great either. Let's leave aside the charitable work that missionaries often do, that is admirable. Let's look at the reason they're really there, to convert people. Missionaries are going to someone else's country, telling them that their beliefs are wrong, and trying to convince them to believe something else. And usually the people they're trying to convert didn't ask for any of that. The proselytizing part itself is mostly just annoying people. \nSo while missionaries might have good intentions and might do charitable work while they're on missionary trips, the spreading their message part isn't admirable regardless of how sincere and honest the missionary's belief is.",
">\n\nI think when you start talking about killing you are turning this into something outside of my description of a repesctful missionary. Also, slight tangent, but mission trips are garbage. I'm referring to a personal connection, and likely no organized church involved. \nI would say the murderer is a very committed person but not respectful. A respectful person would give other resources/tools to make the decision themself (to kill themselves before turning 18). \nRespect is a matter of opinion, tho. I get it. But I'm not sure how else to word it.",
">\n\nGoing and killing people and going on a mission to convert people are obviously not the same. \nBut\nThere are millions of deaths that could be attributed to religious beliefs around the world and so much history lost in destruction of opposing texts.",
">\n\nYou can be a good person with the best of intention, but still cause harm to a place.\nThere is a lot of evidence that Mission Trips aren't only self-serving, they can be harmful. This information is really easily accessible to anyone with google. \nIf you have good intentions and you want to help a place, why do something that is going to harm it? Why not help people in a way that doesn't have harmful effects? I'm not berating children, but adults should know better. \nAnd at some point, if you know that this could hurt a place, but you're going to go ahead and do it anyway, are you doing it for good reasons? Or are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?",
">\n\nMission trips are utter garbage. Fuck those. No need to CMV on that one haha.\n\nOr are you doing it because you want to feel good about yourself or save face in your religious community?\n\nIf this is somebody's motive, they are working for a church and not a God. Again, I don't consider myself a believer, but I know sincere believers who hate churches for many of the reasons people are discussing here.\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)",
">\n\n\nI am referring to respectful, personal efforts to inform another person of a route to salvation (and this wouldn't include any lifestyle judgement by the missionary - this is not their role, but God's, per what I've been told by this type of person)\n\nBut without reading their mind, how can you tell which one's which?\nIt's like saying, \"it's possible that a couple people doing this highly problematic action are doing it because they genuinely believe they're doing good, and they're not doing some of the more obviously detrimental parts of the action, thus they are admirable\"\nSure, it's not outside the realm of possibility, but so what? \nAs an example, I'm sure some parents who abuse their kids genuinely believe that's what's best for the kid, and they make sure they don't go \"too far\", like they won't outright beat their kids, are they admirable? After all, in their mind, they are benefiting the child.",
">\n\nThere's a few things that make missionaries unliked. \n\n\nPrivacy. Someone's home is their ultimate form of privacy, where they can do whatever they want without a single judging eye. Most people don't want others coming onto their property without permission, which is exactly what missionaries do.\n\n\nBelief. What if that person doesn't believe in your God? What if their beliefs mean that you are going to hell for preaching about a false deity. Can they start harrasing you to convert to their religion? My answer is no. \n\n\nAlso, the point you make about them trying to save you from damnation is a faulty one. If my religion told me that only sinners keep their left ears foes that make it justifiable for me to jump on you and cut yours off? After all, I'm only trying to make sure that you got to heaven. We have no concrete proof that God exists other than a book written by men thousands of years ago. If that's makes him true, then what makes all other religions that people write about false?",
">\n\nI'm Jewish.\nOur history is filled with \"well-meaning\" people who sincerely believe in their faith trying to destroy our culture by converting us, then when they fail, killing us.\nNot just once. Not a few times. Over and over and over again, all around the globe.\nBeliefs don't exist in a vacuum. When there is a power differential between those who engage in missionary work and those who have no choice but to accept it, it is not a good thing being done from the perspective of those on the receiving end.\nAnd, in the world today, Christian missionaries have immense power. They spend amazing amounts of money bribing governments around the globe to ensure they have access to tribal people. And then the go to those tribes with the express intent of destroying their way of life.\nFurther, they spend a ton of money doing things like lobbying to ensure that homosexuals receives the death penalty, etc. Since it wasn't enough that Europeans imported homophobia driven by the Christians into Africa in the first place.\nThe destruction of cultures is never ok, no matter how well-meaning those seeking to do it proclaim themselves. It is always evil, and those doing it know this. \nWhen operating from a position of power differential and seeking to destroy another person's entire way of life, one can not be 'respectful.\"",
">\n\nThis is entirely contingent on whether or not you agree with the underlying message they are trying to promote. If we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same way, even if they used the same methods and provided the same help.\nPeople that have an issue with missionaries start with an issue with the underlying theology. Many of the civil rights issues that plague parts of the world are due in large part to how that book says you should live your life, and many people don't want to see that ideology spread at all.",
">\n\n\nIf we were to substitute \"Christians\" for \"Nazis\" I doubt we'd feel the same\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer trying to save a friend. A Christian missionary that I'm describing (not somebody on a missions trip, or somebody working for a church) has the goal of saving other people's souls. I personally don't believe that's even possible, but I cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \nAlso, a \"church\" is not necessarily a good representation of a religion in many cases. The Catholic church, for example, has some beliefs that are very contradictory to the Bible. I think society often assumes churches accurately speak for their religion.",
">\n\n\nSure, but I see a major difference between the end goal of the Nazis and the end goal of a sincere Bible believer.\n\nWhich is what I said. You agree with one ideology, so it isn't problematic. If you disagree with the ideology, it becomes an issue.\n\nA Christian missionary has the goal of saving other people's souls\n\nSure, but the Nazis had the goal of saving Germany. Sincerity does not mean that their cause is nobel.\n\nI cant knock somebody for loving me enough to give me their two cents. \n\nI can if that love comes with trying to convert or oppress people who don't go along with what that book says is right. Many of the issues being faced in America today - LGBTQ acceptance, abortion access, etc. - are because of things that book says. That book causes problems, and many don't want to see that ideology spread.",
">\n\nWe are just too far apart on the Nazi and Christian thing. I get what you are saying tho. \nThe type of missionary I'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point. Many of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so. Churches, however, are often hate spreaders.",
">\n\n\nI'm describing has tunnel vision on salvation, and would not judge others for their \"sin\" in place of their God taking over by that point.\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book. I don't like many of those rules, so I have an issue when people are trying to get other people to follow them via a fear (that I think is made up) for their souls.\n\nMany of the true religious people I know (Christians, Jews, Muslims - all of which practice a religion which claims homosexuality is a sin) would never spread hatred over the matter, because it isn't really their place to do so.\n\nMany don't, but many do spread hate using that books as their rationale. This makes me want fewer people to use that book as the basis of their morality.",
">\n\n\nBut to achieve salvation, the person being saved must begin to adhere to the rules of the book\n\nOk, this is where we aren't seeing eye to eye. It's just a matter of interpretation, tho. \nI have read the Bible, and my understanding (along with what one of my best friends, a type of personal missionary, believes) is that the Bible is there to guide a fulfilling life as their God has planned, but salvation is achieved by fully asking for forgiveness and personally declaring Jesus as the only true savior. Based on this interpretation, \"sinners\" of all types will be in the Christian heaven.\nGood discussion tho tbh, respect",
">\n\nAh, but it isn't just declaring him your savior - you have to sincerely do it. And if you sincerely do it, you have to at least try to live your life by the rules he laid out. You think that his teachings are good and moral, and you should aspire to live like that (even if you fail sometimes). A murderer doesn't get into heaven if he accepts Jesus and keeps right on murdering.\nIf I don't agree with those teachings, then I don't want people to try and live their lives like that.",
">\n\nI've never met a single Christian who believes that.",
">\n\nMissionary groups are too often involved in human trafficking, particularly human trafficking of minors. It's a multi-million dollar industry.\nNo amount of supposed good intention undoes that level of corruption and cruelty.",
">\n\nThis is true. I'd say that stuff would definitely fall under the insincere motives that I'm not referring to.\nI'm talking somebody dedicating their life to saving others without being instructed specifically to be an entity such as a church. Just sincere, grassroots salvation outside of an organization.",
">\n\nYeah but to them it is sincere motives sometimes. They’re saying someone from a pagan culture that will inevitably damn their soul to hell. So for them it’s better to abduct them in life so they can go to the good place in the afterlife. Those people genuinely believe their doing a good thing by taking that person away.",
">\n\nMaybe add \"respectful\" to my definition then, along with sincere.",
">\n\nAnd to they are showing respect to you, they’re doing everything they can to save your soul. What that old saying? The road to hell is paved with good intentions.",
">\n\nOur disagreement boils down to interpretation of respect. I would say it's objectively disrespectful to kidnap people regardless of circumstance. I get what you are saying, but that's where we don't see eye to eye.",
">\n\nIn your title you call ctitiscism missionaries recieve \"blind hatred\". Why do see it as such, and not just as the sincerely held belief in the opposite direction from the missionaries?\nCan you understand how the side you're attributing with blind hate is seeing the missionaries in the same way?",
">\n\nI see it as blind hatred because so many people here love to hate on religion, and they see no difference between problematic, hideous mission trips by a church to chance a society, and a personal effort to save an individuals soul.\nThe second religious talk comes up, it's like blood in water and everybody hates the missionary. But I feel loved when people sincerely and respectfully try to save my soul. Churches, however, are frequently not sincere in their motives.",
">\n\n\na personal effort to save an individuals soul.\n\nCan you give some real life examples of what this would be?\n\nhideous mission trips by a church to chance a society\n\nThis is what a missionary is though. If you have people hearing missionary and disliking what that means, it's because it means the exact thing you yourself see as hideous.",
">\n\nI have a friend who moves every year to do farm work as his career. He gets involved in a real way in his community, but also will spread the \"good word\" to the people he forms relationships with. He doesn't work for a church, or even attend one. \nHe is a self described missionary, and he's exactly not a rare type of dude. I know other people like him (some of which I met through him). He does not tell others how to live their lives, but acts a a resource for people to learn more about his faith (which he views as truth), and prays for God to open people in his world up to what he has to say, if asked.\nThis is a style of missionary work that exists on a larger scale than I think a lot of people here realize. Maybe not the moving around part to meet new communities, but certainly the respectful, personal part. And they would describe it as Biblical missions work.\nAnd, even as loving and great as my friend is, i have witnessed the \"Reddit demographic\" type of person shit all over his lifestyle because he talks about religion openly. But he still wants to save even those people, if they becoming willing. He's a solid dude, and (again) not a one-of-a-kind type of missionary.",
">\n\nSo according to Christina theology, those who reject Christ are doomed to hell.\nSo what happens when missionaries visit a place, teach about Christ, and those people reject that message.\nNow they are doomed to hell.\nSeems like they would have been better off if the missionaries had never visited.",
">\n\nA mosquito that sincerely wants to bite you is still an annoyance.\nI can respect the determination of missionaries and at the same time say that what they are doing is a problem.\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Does that mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere? That covers terrorists and some serial killers for example.",
">\n\n\nan annoyance\n\nWell I didn't say these people aren't often annoying as hell lol, but I don't see how sincere, respectful missionaries are problematic beyond this. Yes, I think their goals are ultimately pointless but I have to admire how they love others. \n\nPeople can sincerely believe that they should harm people. Doeathat mean they shouldn't be stopped just because they are sincere?\n\nAbsolutely not!",
">\n\nTheir love is beyond the point, that's just useless feelings that weren't asked for. They do practical harm.\nThey destroy cultures, impose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\nSpreading their ideology is a problem. It's not pointless, sometimes they succeed, and that's bad.\nThey spread homophobia throughout africa for example. And their views against contraception and sex in general.",
">\n\n\nimpose rules and propaganda, prey on the weak to get future followers and donators.\n\nAll of this, along with the homophobia thing, is not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. All that stuff is work of a church and government. All that is awful, but missionary work comes in many different forms.\nPeople shit on all missionaries because of horror stories like what you describe, and I think some humble, repsectful, and sincere efforts get unfairly swept into the same group as the others.",
">\n\n\nis not included in the type of missionary work I'm referring to. \n\nThen what is? That is the actual stuff they believe in, the actual practices that they sincerely believe people need to be \"saved\" from so they don't end up in hell.\nThe bible says gay people should be killed. Missionaries spread that ideology into africa. Gay people were killed. The missionaries tell people not to use contraception. So they die of STIs. The missionaries tell people to have as many children as possible to act as breeding stock for more believers. So those people do and have more children than they can afford, leading to children suffering.\nIt's not horror stories. What true believer sincere missionaries are you talking about that at the same time don't actually believe or spread or enable any of these harmful ideologies.\nIf they were respectful, they wouldn't try to convert people, that's inherently disrespectful.",
">\n\nMore Christians live in Africa than any other continent in the world.\nSouth Africa's weekly church attendance s at 56-60 % per week. Alaska's weekly attendance ranks it at the bottom 10 states, with 26 attending weekly. \nMissionaries can have a harmful impact on the places they visit. This is really well documented and easy information to access. Any adult can access this information. I think a reasonable adult would look at this, and wonder if there is something else they could be doing? \nIf you are genuinely concerned for the well-being of the people you plan to visit, you would question if your actions are going to be beneficial or harmful. And a reasonable person, who is actually doing this for sincere reasons, would probably say they don't want to risk hurting the people they're planning on preaching to. \nAnd if its a sincerely-held belief and not an excuse for a cool, self-servicing vacation, you'd just go to somewhere like Alaska and preach there. \nFaith has been used as a justification for horrible things. Its not a great excuse.",
">\n\nMission trips are total bullshit. Maybe I should have explicitly called those out in my post. \nI'm referring to respectful people who aim to provide the salvation tools to others in a personal way. Not a \"hit it n quit it\" route.",
">\n\nOk, I think I understand what you're saying. I've read more of your comments in the thread as well.\nIf there are valid criticisms with Christian missionaries, criticisms you at least partially agree with, then it isn’t blind hatred. It’s an informed opinion. \nBut like, what you're doing is, rather than address the valid criticisms of actual harm that missionary work can do, you're creating a new definition of missionary work that tries to exclude the undesirable aspects.\nAnd I don't like how this pairs with statements you made like how Reddit loves to \"endlessly rip on religion.\" Are people being unreasonably hateful, or are they critiquing the bad parts you acknowledge exist?\nI think you've created a situation where any legitimate concern about missionaries can easily be dismissed the types of people who aren't the focus of you're discussion.\nCan you clarify more? Who are you talking about? People who hand out chick tracts? Christians who ring the doorbell or cold call you on the phone? People who hand out pamphlets at subway stations?\nBut yeah, I think that all missionary work is inherently disrespectful. Its disrespectful to think that someone's faith or spirituality is sending them to hell. Its disrespectful to make all these assumptions about other people's religious beliefs. Like it or not ,you're creating a hierarchy between yourself and other people. \nGood intentions aren't enough. Just because its your faith doesn't mean its necessarily the right faith for everyone, and refusing to accept that perpetuates supremacist rhetoric. It",
">\n\nI am Christian, but there is some questionable stuff in the Bible. Rapists should marry their victims, it's okay to have slaves, homosexuality is wrong, the God of the Bible killed a lot of babies. Just look what he did to job, killed his whole family to win a bet, but its okay because he replaced them? And the way women are treated and often spoken about in the Bible is so dehumanizing. They are meant to submit to their husband's and while some Christian faiths allow women to be leaders in the church, the Bible very clearly speaks against it. I can see why people don't want these messages getting spread.",
">\n\nLet me come at it this way. \nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\nWhy? Because then the believer is on a culturally and financially even playing field and even more importantly, everyone they're preaching to has voluntarily agreed to hear it in a profoundly knowing way. \nIf I'm friends with someone who has really found a particular kind of salvation in a particular religion and they want to tell me about their experience as part of our friendship--perhaps with the hope that I too will share in this salvation--at least we have a prior reason to trust one another, to understand one another, and some existing agreement to listen to and value one another. \nIf Mr. Smith down the street is, in addition to being the guy who brings a great casserole to the annual block party and loaning me his lawnmower and coming to zoning board meetings someone who wants to tell me about his religion, that's part of the community connection we have in our ordinary lives. It gives me a chance, in fact, to see whether he actually lives his religion in a deep and committed sense or is just somebody who preaches it at me. \nA missionary, in contrast, however nice or sincere they are, is someone who feels the obligation to go far away from home among strangers that he doesn't know or have any prior standing with and whose ordinary life in that place is just about preaching. They don't have a job or mow the lawn or build ordinary friendships that aren't about converting people, and whether they successful live the values of their religion besides trying to spread it is difficult to discern. The missionary, however nice or sincere, often is choosing a community of people who are in a state of material vulnerability and want who can't avoid dependency on some outside provider of services, gifts, or support, whether it's a religious mission or an international development agency. \nThe missionary in that situation, however nice or sincere they are, often doesn't know the language. If they know the language, they don't know the culture or the community. They didn't grow up there and they likely aren't going to be staying there. The people they're talking to didn't initiate the conversation with the missionary or seek them out, most of the time. (So, for example, that's a difference between a Catholic priest or Protestant minister going to work with people far away who are already part of their congregation. By definition, the missionary is among people who have not yet joined that religion.)\nA person who wants to convince others to seek salvation is best off sticking to the people they know best, who want to listen to them, in an environment where they aren't taking advantage of peoples' vulnerabilities, and where they can demonstrate the meaning of their faith alongside peers in everyday life. In short, not a missionary. Missionary work by its nature is an attempt to escape the hard work of persuading friends, family and neighbors by looking for an easy target among vulnerable and needy strangers.",
">\n\n\nIf a person really believes in the Bible and want to spread the Good Word, why not stick to trying to bring that word to people with whom you already have a relationship or some valid form of standing? People they know personally, people who value and trust the believer, people who live in the neighborhood and community of the believer.\n\nExactly! This is who I am talking about! Missionary work is not always a far away experience. What you describe here does happen. Local efforts with established relationships.\nThe Mission is to equip people with resources that may save their souls. The Bible calls for missionary work, and it doesn't all look the same, obviously. Then secular entities have taken missionary work to be the ugly thing you went on to describe, where a ower dynamic is in play.",
">\n\nI think you've done something that makes CMV threads kind of pointless, which is to define a word in a way that no one else defines it, and shift your definition every time someone gets too close to a valid challenge to your point of view. That's on display here in two ways: first, that you are saying that all missionary work that is \"the ugly thing\" isn't really missionary work despite the fact that all those ugly things describe themselves as missions with missionaries, the general culture defines missionary work in that way, etc. This is what's often known as the \"no true Scotsman\" fallacy in arguments, and it's something you really shouldn't do if you're posting something in CMV.\nThe second problem is that you are redefining my point--that ordinary persuasion or proselytizing conversations between people who naturally have an association is fine, it's just missionary projects that aim to convert strangers who have no social standing with the proselytizer and have not chosen to listen to their message that are the problem (whether they're near or far). It's fine to talk to friends, family and close neighbors or associates about anything they're willing to listen to: why you really like The Last Jedi, why you vote for the Libertarian Party, why you really love avocado toast, or why you're a Pentecostal Christian. That's not being a missionary: that's being human with the people who have chosen to maintain an association with your humanity. \nIt's deciding that you are called upon to change the faith of strangers who haven't asked you to do so--to assume that they are ignorant of your message rather than conscious, intentional human beings who have their own beliefs and thoughts--that is the problem. It's especially a problem in missionary work, which means what it means to most people, whatever your private understanding of it--but it's even a problem in more ordinary ways because at the end of the day, there's a hubris about it: that you have heard a message that you assume other people need to hear, but that you do not need to hear their testimony first, or to be in a conversation. Anything where you set out to change another person where you are not yourself open to being changed, anything where you want to preach your message but are certain that the message of others is not relevant to you? That's what proselytizing involves, by definition. It's not a conversation or a dialogue or a sharing. It's someone shouting truth at people in the presumption that they don't have truth themselves.",
">\n\nidk i see the worth in doing good things for communities in different countries, but actively proselytizing to others? i feel like you can only value that as a good thing if you're christian; for everyone else at bare minimum its neutral",
">\n\nWhy does it have to be in another country? I have met missionaries who live down the street from me. They've given me their \"good word\".",
">\n\nThe truth is the white man's help ALWAYS has strings attached. Those who accept help so often end up paying the price",
">\n\nWell... I am white. One of my best friends is a black man who travels around the country doing farm work while spreading what he feels is a truth to save others' souls. He isn't sent by a church or organization, he just really believes in saving others. He was the reason for this \"dead at work\" boredom post actually, so might as well describe him here. \nHe doesn't care about judging others, because his Bible instructs that only God is to do that, not humans. So while he will talk to LGBTQ people about salvation, for example, he won't even address sexual orientation or \"sin\" or whatever. He just feels responsible for aiding in salvation, and nothing more - as he feels the Bible instructs.\nThis is the missionary work I'm referring to. At that point, he would allow God to take over in guiding somebody's life.\nI don't believe any of this shit, but I have no problem with it.",
">\n\nDo you believe your friends is an exception or the standard?",
">\n\nTough question. Missionary work is not always \"visit a place and spread the word\". It is often a personal thing among existing relationships between nonbelievers and Christians. No travel involved. \nI will however claim \"exception\" regarding my friend, based on his disdain towards churches (at least what we recognize the term \"church\" to mean today). Though I know more than a few Christians who despise churches, based off of how far the organizations often stray from Biblical word.",
">\n\n\nPeople, especially here on Reddit, love to relentlessly rip on religion - especially Christianity.\n\nPeople like attacking others. If they were allowed to attack homosexuals or black people without being ostracized from their own communities, they would do so. Christians are one of the few groups that those on the left feel it is okay to go after.\nThe point is that they aren't recieving \"too much blind hatred\": they're receiving exactly as much as you would expect from a society filled with toxic people who need to direct their toxicity at an ever-shrinking list of targets.",
">\n\n\nAnd certainly not missionary work in the name of political gain\n\nSee, here's the thing... what is the difference between a political agenda and a religion?\nI'd argue that every religion also contains an agenda that is spread with the belief. It just contains extras, such as supernatural elements and cultural parts - there is generally also a \"political\" element.",
">\n\nSo from the perspective of a non believer and knowing nothing else about the missionary other than they are a true believer earnestly spreading their word, I would say that lends evidence to the idea that they’re probably a decent person. \nBut being a missionary does not mean you aren’t an otherwise bad person, maybe they’re doing it in part as a way to try to make up for other bad things they’ve done. \nIn other words even if we assume the act itself is good, that doesn’t mean they’re not a bad person more generally. Bottom line it’s just not much evidence to go off. \nHowever moving away from judgements about their character, we can then look at whether what they’re doing causes harm or not. A good person earnestly trying to do good can actually cause harm. \nSpreading religion like it’s the answer to the world’s problems could be seen as a net negative. I’m not saying it is, just that there’s w reasonable argument to say it is.",
">\n\nInherently, the \"mission\" of a missionary is to try to sway people to their belief system. Even if this is done innocently, and with good intention.\nThere are incredibly respectful missionaries for Jehovah's Witnesses at the train station that I go through every day. Meeting your weirdly narrow standard, they are respectful, and likely really do genuinely intend to spread goodness and help others. But they are also selling the message of a rather controversial group that has substantially sketchy things on the resume, and reject medicine as well as free speech.\nThese people are, by your standard, trying to save you from pain in their eyes. But their message is such that if it works, they could be leading someone down a pretty dark path.\nAnd by the way, Thanos had missionaries too.",
">\n\n\n(without instruction from & affiliation with a church)\n\nI haven't read all the comments yet to see if anyone else asked about this, but is this a thing? \nSo you wouldn't be counting the Mormon (etc.) missionaries?",
">\n\nWhether someone “truly believes” what they are doing is good has no bearing on whether it is in fact good.",
">\n\nJust because they have fiction stories they want to spread doesn't in inherently make them good people. \nThey aren't doing anything real. Saving souls is meaningless. Any time saving souls is time wasted on useless efforts. \nThey aren't helping people. They aren't feeding people. They aren't educating people. They are just getting another notch for their spiritual belt.",
">\n\nThe whole point of missionary work is to destroy all other cultures and religions and replace them with a dominant one. They may be convinced that this is for a good cause, but it is ultimately deeply destructive. It doesn't stop being destructive just because they've imagined a justification for the behavior."
] |
As far back as I can remember, I always wanted to be in a mafia movie. | [] |
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